You've been fortunate to have purchased the brands that you did as some brands don't support surround in all configurations. Sony and LG seem to have a reputation for carrying it over while Sharp and Samsung had a reputation for not carrying surround sound from HDMI to TOSLINK.
Got a 4K TV. Do I need to replace everything else now?
- Thread starter Pepper
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Replies 63
- Views 7K
Here's another just for you. Those two won't accomplish what he needs. If he connects it to any non current compliant device from any port, he only gets the best that the worst device can support.
In his case the 4K TV if connected to non-4K devices via the splitter ensures he won't get 4K on his set. That is the bigger issue surrounding these splitters.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I was uniquely commenting on your broad statement that Monoprice splitters don't support UHD.
You're correct if the TV doesn't support surround audio input, even a "splitter of questionable compliance" won't help as the TV will respond to the source that it can't support full surround and the AVR will only get whatever the TV supports. If the TV lies, you may get more than you expected through ARC (but even that requires an HDMI 1.4 compatible AVR).
Those who want to insure the full audio experience from their UHD programming pretty much need to have an HDCP 2.2 capable AVR. The only exceptions to this seem to be the high-end UHD Blu-ray players.
There's also the question of support for ARC (part of HDMI 1.4) and how individual TVs send their audio out of the AVR. I'm not sure where (or whether) HDCP comes into play on ARC and whether a TV with a negotiated HDCP session will forward 5.1 sound to TOSLINK.
Can't comment on Sharp but Samsung certainly has, I have a four year old Samsung that has it as well as my JU model from last year that has it. Of course I can't know about every model from every manufacturer. My LG goes back also about 4 years maybe 5 now and it needed an advanced menu change but it too carries 5.1 over Toslink from HDMI sources. Note that my JU model needed a little simple trick to get set up but does it no problem. (For those familiar same type trick as setting the HDMI Black level to low) I have little doubt many never pursued how to enable it. The question is why some models came with it not enabled since the TV is capable of it.
You're getting a little mixed up. HDCP is the encryption standard and only has to do with giving the source permission to output the licensed content at the highest resolution it can. If one device in the chain, including the splitter and the stuff it is hooked to, aren't fully HDCP 2.2 compliant, then no 4K.
The audio is a separate set of issues.
1. ARC - the audio return channel, if supported by both the TV and AVR is DD5.1 output if the source material is. It will also step down DD+ to DD5.1.
2. Optical - a mixed bag, most modern sets do DD5.1 via optical, but not all do. Especially at the lower end.
3. HDCP & ARC - nothing to do with each other as far as I've been able to discern. It mostly has to do with HDMI control which is a different animal. You can have ARC support without having the HDMI power control active.
The one other issue is with some 4K TVs. Not all support HDCP 2.2 and 4K on all their inputs. My Sharp does. Note that ARC is usually only functional on HDMI 1. But you can have an input on the other HDMI ports and output the sound back to the AVR via ARC as that stays active. Or at least it does on TVs I've researched or bought.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Thanks lparsons21 for the good info. Can you explain what exactly is the audio retrun channel (ARC)? I understand what CEC is but ARC is a little confusing to me. Thanks
ARC uses just the HDMI ports to pass audio from the TV back to the AVR. Usually it is port 1 on the TV. It isn't better or worse than using optical but it allows for reduced cable count at the TV. IOW, instead of a HDMI connection and optical back to get audio, you get the audio back via ARC. Note that not all TVs or AVRs support it and some of the earlier implementations didn't work well.
Today most AVRs beyond entry level do support ARC as do many TVs. Note that you don't get better audio from ARC vice optical as both only support DD5.1 at most.
Today most AVRs beyond entry level do support ARC as do many TVs. Note that you don't get better audio from ARC vice optical as both only support DD5.1 at most.
High-bandwidthDigitalContentProtection, like the DRM it is designed to implement, isn't limited to video. It applies to audio as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-bandwidth_Digital_Content_Protection
As noted, an HDCP failure meant that the video portion would be SD and the audio would be CD quality at best. I'm not sure how they are supposed to deal with falling back to a lesser HDMI standard.
Having tested this in various scenarios, something has to be wrong in your link.
I can and have connected the H3 and FireTV box, both have 4K videos accessible.
When connected to a complete 4K/HDCP 2.2 chain, I get 4K and whatever audio is normal. Typically DD+
When connected to a non-HDCP 2.2 chain, I get whatever the source device decides I can support. With the H3 that is 1080i, with the FireTV that is 1080p, and both still do DD+ or DD5.1. The only way I think you would get SD is if the display device was SD and according to some articles I've read, all devices in the chain would only 'see' SD. I would assume that with an HDMI 2.2 splitter if one display device is SD only, then all devices would get SD.
In that scenario I don't know what the audio would be as I don't have any way to test it.
Bottom line is that if you put in an HDMI 2.2 compliant splitter, the best you get is what the worst display can handle.
Lloyd
I can and have connected the H3 and FireTV box, both have 4K videos accessible.
When connected to a complete 4K/HDCP 2.2 chain, I get 4K and whatever audio is normal. Typically DD+
When connected to a non-HDCP 2.2 chain, I get whatever the source device decides I can support. With the H3 that is 1080i, with the FireTV that is 1080p, and both still do DD+ or DD5.1. The only way I think you would get SD is if the display device was SD and according to some articles I've read, all devices in the chain would only 'see' SD. I would assume that with an HDMI 2.2 splitter if one display device is SD only, then all devices would get SD.
In that scenario I don't know what the audio would be as I don't have any way to test it.
Bottom line is that if you put in an HDMI 2.2 compliant splitter, the best you get is what the worst display can handle.
Lloyd
Theoretically speaking, if I get the splitter, compatible AVR and cables so that I have a HDCP 2.2 path to the 4K TV, I just need to make sure all the older TVs are powered off (or worst case, disconnect their HDMI cables) when I want to watch 4K content. That would be a workable solution for me.
Pepper, yes that would seem to be the way to accomplish what you want. It will be interesting to see if just powering off the non-compliant sets will be enough. Another way might be to find a HDMI switch that is HDCP 2.2 compliant and use it to accomplish the same thing. You'd need to have a really good universal remote to set up the switching I would think.
One problem might be getting a compliant switch. A few months back I was looking for one and couldn't find any, don't know if that has changed yet.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
One problem might be getting a compliant switch. A few months back I was looking for one and couldn't find any, don't know if that has changed yet.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I don't think splitters and switches are the answer for the reasons you've presented. That said, I question whether an HDMI 1.x device will respond at all to an HDMI 2.x query.
If you're going to have to spend a good chunk of change, you might as well get a new AVR and skip all the experimentation. Of course the moment I type this, the industry is going to throw in the towel on HDMI and move to DisplayPort as they should have the moment HDMI 1.x wasn't enough.
Yeah, the tech just keeps on keeping on! Mostly helping vacuuming our wallet along the way! 
I tend to agree with you though. You can jury rig all kinds of things to make them work, but in the end it gets to usually a mess of wires and convoluted programming of a universal remote so you don't have to juggle a slew of dedicated remotes.
I started with a Harman-Kardon 3600 that was OK for 3D but didn't do any 4K at all, also only had 4 HDMI ports. I fiddled with that by connecting 3 devices to the TV, 3 devices to the AVR and some devices to a HDMI switch. It all worked, but was such a mess that I just bit the bullet.
Wanted to stay with Harman Kardon, but alas their last AVRs weren't HDCP 2.2 compliant and really not very good at all, so I started researching. Finally settled on an Onkyo 757 which was fully compliant on 3 HDMI ports and had 5 ports that weren't, more than good enough. Even though it wasn't cheap, it sure is excellent!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I tend to agree with you though. You can jury rig all kinds of things to make them work, but in the end it gets to usually a mess of wires and convoluted programming of a universal remote so you don't have to juggle a slew of dedicated remotes.
I started with a Harman-Kardon 3600 that was OK for 3D but didn't do any 4K at all, also only had 4 HDMI ports. I fiddled with that by connecting 3 devices to the TV, 3 devices to the AVR and some devices to a HDMI switch. It all worked, but was such a mess that I just bit the bullet.
Wanted to stay with Harman Kardon, but alas their last AVRs weren't HDCP 2.2 compliant and really not very good at all, so I started researching. Finally settled on an Onkyo 757 which was fully compliant on 3 HDMI ports and had 5 ports that weren't, more than good enough. Even though it wasn't cheap, it sure is excellent!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I pretty much came to the same conclusion. For the first few weeks, I had this convoluted mess of an old Onkyo 615 with only 3 HDMI inputs, an external switch, optical feed back from the TV and a UHD player connected to both TV and receiver. I got fed up, but I went Denon with a 4300 receiver. Again, not cheap, but something I can grow into a bit. At my age, I think this may be the last upgrade.Yeah, the tech just keeps on keeping on! Mostly helping vacuuming our wallet along the way!
I tend to agree with you though. You can jury rig all kinds of things to make them work, but in the end it gets to usually a mess of wires and convoluted programming of a universal remote so you don't have to juggle a slew of dedicated remotes.
I started with a Harman-Kardon 3600 that was OK for 3D but didn't do any 4K at all, also only had 4 HDMI ports. I fiddled with that by connecting 3 devices to the TV, 3 devices to the AVR and some devices to a HDMI switch. It all worked, but was such a mess that I just bit the bullet.
Wanted to stay with Harman Kardon, but alas their last AVRs weren't HDCP 2.2 compliant and really not very good at all, so I started researching. Finally settled on an Onkyo 757 which was fully compliant on 3 HDMI ports and had 5 ports that weren't, more than good enough. Even though it wasn't cheap, it sure is excellent!
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I'm a geek so I'm sure this isn't my last upgrade, even at 73!
I had a Denon in the past, fine AVR but to me they are pretty flat and my ears are anything but! I loved the sweetness of HK's stuff and the Onkyo came closest to it in sound.
That said, I have a nearly new HK AVR2700 that I got with a fire sale price, unfortunately it doesn't do 4K. Sweet sounding though...
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
My dad just turned 70 and keeps saying this or that will be last upgrade. Now he bought a new 65in 4K over Thanksgiving and moved the old 65in 1080p into his bedroom and got rid of the older 60 in plasma that was in there. Last year it was a new truck and Surface Pro 4. I told him, everyone says you can't take it with you, so you might as well spend it and get what you like and enjoy it now. They upgraded my stepmom's ipad and iphone yesterday, even though her iphone 6 and Air 2 were just fine.
He likes being able to check the IP camera's at each house on his phone, whether they are in Las Vegas or Tulsa, so I got him a starter wifi lighting kit to play with for Christmas, so he can turn the lights on at the Tulsa house while in Vegas. The camera here is older and not as good in low light. I'm sure that will lead to some other home automation stuff now.
He likes being able to check the IP camera's at each house on his phone, whether they are in Las Vegas or Tulsa, so I got him a starter wifi lighting kit to play with for Christmas, so he can turn the lights on at the Tulsa house while in Vegas. The camera here is older and not as good in low light. I'm sure that will lead to some other home automation stuff now.
LOL, good for your dad. I have a garage door opener app that I can tell if the door is closed or not and can operate the door too from my cell phone. It has all the alerts and whistles and bells, etc. Also I have a smart home HVAC thermostat. I can change my homes temperature, all the settings, etc from cell phone. I bet your dad would like that stuff too. Maybe next Xmas.
ok, thanks everyone for participating. This is quite informative.
I went ahead and got a HDCP 2.2 compatible AVR (well, "getting" it in a few days) and I ordered one of those splitters and enough "certified premium" cables to complete the path from hopper to tv, and a direct path if necessary.
I also read everything Wikipedia has on HDMI and HDCP, and got more confused than I already was, not to mention angry as well (because the whole point of it all is making everything even more complicated and inconvenient on the general consumer to try to stop a few dirty pirates), and half convinced that what I really need is that device with two inputs and two outputs and just so happens to strip out the HDCP, and is the subject of a lawsuit, and which will probably get me disciplined for even mentioning its name here (so I won't).
I went ahead and got a HDCP 2.2 compatible AVR (well, "getting" it in a few days) and I ordered one of those splitters and enough "certified premium" cables to complete the path from hopper to tv, and a direct path if necessary.
I also read everything Wikipedia has on HDMI and HDCP, and got more confused than I already was, not to mention angry as well (because the whole point of it all is making everything even more complicated and inconvenient on the general consumer to try to stop a few dirty pirates), and half convinced that what I really need is that device with two inputs and two outputs and just so happens to strip out the HDCP, and is the subject of a lawsuit, and which will probably get me disciplined for even mentioning its name here (so I won't).
Similar threads
