Ecoda 22Khz reliability
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Very interesting.....
We corrected the "CONTROLEED" misspelling for the co-branded product on the first order. Possibly the engineer was not in the loop with the sales department when he provided information regarding the design variances. We had provide photos of the other product and asked him to confirm if it was their product. He replied that it was not their design and asked were we obtained the sample....
We had requested that they swap the port commands to better match the cabling for the Glorystar systems. Ecoda engineers had advised that swapping the ports resulted in increased switching errors and advised that we should not change the design......
Maybe our design requests might might have infringed on another customers OEM or exclusive distribution agreement. Well in light of the replies, the earlier clone statement could be incorrect.... We will dig a little deeper with the manufacturer. If we learn more information, we will share with the forum.
Update: Pulled some early samples of their product received two years ago and the ports are elongated, but the port commands are not as pictured on the site. The mystery remains......
We corrected the "CONTROLEED" misspelling for the co-branded product on the first order. Possibly the engineer was not in the loop with the sales department when he provided information regarding the design variances. We had provide photos of the other product and asked him to confirm if it was their product. He replied that it was not their design and asked were we obtained the sample....
We had requested that they swap the port commands to better match the cabling for the Glorystar systems. Ecoda engineers had advised that swapping the ports resulted in increased switching errors and advised that we should not change the design......
Maybe our design requests might might have infringed on another customers OEM or exclusive distribution agreement. Well in light of the replies, the earlier clone statement could be incorrect.... We will dig a little deeper with the manufacturer. If we learn more information, we will share with the forum.
Update: Pulled some early samples of their product received two years ago and the ports are elongated, but the port commands are not as pictured on the site. The mystery remains......
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I bought my switch on Ebay, but don't remember from who. It was less than $10.
Mine is the EC-2111 model, manufactured by Digital Technology Company, LTD.
The 22Khz is on the left, 0Khz on the right.
Right now, waiting on email from company... from China.
Brian, I have been trying to operate two motorized dish using the EC-2111 Ecoda switch. The problem is that BOTH 0Khz and 22Khz ports are passing power from the receiver at the same time. I, like Iceberg and others, thought it would handle what I am doing. Now I believe the switch I have is a clone. Can you take a Ecoda switch you sell and see if it do the same thing? I tested the ports with a multimeter and saw that they are having power at the same time. What happens with me is that BOTH motorized dishes move at the same time when I wanted to go to one dish. (SG2100 HH motors). I removed the switch from the setup until I ge more info.
If you test your switch and it does what it suppose to do, I will order one from you!
I trust you have the original switches that is dependable.
I just picked up a used Acutrac 22 Pro meter off of Craigslist tonight and decided to use it to test my Ecoda switch since it has a 22k setting and dishpro/diseqc port commands. The Ecoda passes DC, diseqc and 22k commands to both ports at all times.
Our version passes power, 22KHz and DiSEqC through both ports at all times. This is the feature that makes Ecoda switches compatible so so many switching schemes.
So, the bottom line is that this switch will not work as far as using two motorized dishes? I am afraid that it would be too much on my FTA receiver.
I have a impression that even if I use a DiSEqC switch it will not work. I read in another thread using the DiSEqC with the Ecoda switch (as far as the setup I am attempting) could be disastous. Please correct me if I am wrong...
Brian, what switch will work with my set up?
I have a impression that even if I use a DiSEqC switch it will not work. I read in another thread using the DiSEqC with the Ecoda switch (as far as the setup I am attempting) could be disastous. Please correct me if I am wrong...
Brian, what switch will work with my set up?
beyond ratings:
Typical LNBs draw in the 90 to 100 milliamp range.
The power handling rating of the Ecoda 22khz switch is 300ma.
So, right there you can see that a motor and an LNB are all the switch can handle.
Most receivers are rated to supply 500ma.
Two LNBs and two motors exceed the capability of the receiver.
So, just because some people can operate their equipment beyond ratings and get away with it, doesn't mean everyone can.
Nor that anyone should. Conditions vary.
That's why I don't recommend running ONE motor after a switch.
Some people get away with it, but that should not be taken as an acceptable design choice.
Clearly, running two motors and two (or more) LNBs is beyond the ratings of both switch and receiver.
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caveat_emptor"]Caveat emptor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame].
According to which specs you read, the little H-H motors draw between 200 and 350 milliamps of current.
Typical LNBs draw in the 90 to 100 milliamp range.
The power handling rating of the Ecoda 22khz switch is 300ma.
So, right there you can see that a motor and an LNB are all the switch can handle.
Most receivers are rated to supply 500ma.
Two LNBs and two motors exceed the capability of the receiver.
So, just because some people can operate their equipment beyond ratings and get away with it, doesn't mean everyone can.
Nor that anyone should. Conditions vary.
That's why I don't recommend running ONE motor after a switch.
Some people get away with it, but that should not be taken as an acceptable design choice.
Clearly, running two motors and two (or more) LNBs is beyond the ratings of both switch and receiver.
[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caveat_emptor"]Caveat emptor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame].
I agree with Anole. The main issue is the draw on the receiver power supply.
There may be a few options for your dual motor installation (using solid copper center conductor, quad or tri shield coax to minimize current draw).
1. I have upgraded the power regulator on many STBs to a LM317t type to provide a higher current (1.5a max.). We have several motors on the roof of the business and regularly drive two in tandem through 100'+ of RG-6. Voids the receiver warranty, but works well....
2. DC block the feeds for the motors and power insert individually for each motor. A benefit includes driving the motor with 18vdc at all times for faster moves between the satellites and more power for lifting the dish off the ends of the arc.
There may be a few options for your dual motor installation (using solid copper center conductor, quad or tri shield coax to minimize current draw).
1. I have upgraded the power regulator on many STBs to a LM317t type to provide a higher current (1.5a max.). We have several motors on the roof of the business and regularly drive two in tandem through 100'+ of RG-6. Voids the receiver warranty, but works well....
2. DC block the feeds for the motors and power insert individually for each motor. A benefit includes driving the motor with 18vdc at all times for faster moves between the satellites and more power for lifting the dish off the ends of the arc.
Thank you so much, Anole, and Brian (?), for this info.
I am disappointed but glad I didn't end up harming my FTA system.
If only that Ecoda switch could switch either side (like the DiSEqc switch does) then it would really serve its purpose. I wonder why such a switch isn't available? Remember I am referring to using two motorized systems.
I really thought the Ecoda switch is set up that way. Shame...
All right, you engineers, get off your butts and figure this out!!!!
I am disappointed but glad I didn't end up harming my FTA system.
If only that Ecoda switch could switch either side (like the DiSEqc switch does) then it would really serve its purpose. I wonder why such a switch isn't available? Remember I am referring to using two motorized systems.
I really thought the Ecoda switch is set up that way. Shame...
All right, you engineers, get off your butts and figure this out!!!!
Didn't even need to get off my butt. Sometimes the solutions have already been provided. As a hobbyist, I would suggest that you might even consider wearing the Junior Engineer's Hat and honorary pocket protector! LOL!!!
A 30 second Google search yields more information:
Solution #1 Cost ...... as low as 29 cents and 10 minutes of your time.
lm317t - Google Product Search
Your system now should be able to handle two motors and a few LNBFs.....
Solution #2 Cost ...... as low as $40 and an hour of your time. Install high frequency single port power passing splitter after each port of the 22KHz switch connect the DC blocked port to power inserters (similar to the Winegard PS-9370) and attach to the motors, connect the DC passing ports of the splitters to the desired LNBF(s).
Winegard PS-9370 - Google Product Search
LOL!!!A 30 second Google search yields more information:
Solution #1 Cost ...... as low as 29 cents and 10 minutes of your time.
lm317t - Google Product Search
- Unplug the STB
- Remove the cover
- Identify the 315 Power Regulator attached to a heat sink located near the tuner
- Remove screw securing Power Regulator to the Heat Sink
- Remove screws securing Motherboard to Chassis and if necessary, the screws and F-fitting nuts from any connections securing the motherboard connections to the rear panel.
- Desolder and remove the 315 Power Regulator
- Solder in the LM317t Power Regulator
- Secure the mother board to the chassis and the connections to the rear panel.
- Secure the LM317t to the heat sink (use heat sink compound for better performance).
- Replace the cover.
Your system now should be able to handle two motors and a few LNBFs.....
Solution #2 Cost ...... as low as $40 and an hour of your time. Install high frequency single port power passing splitter after each port of the 22KHz switch connect the DC blocked port to power inserters (similar to the Winegard PS-9370) and attach to the motors, connect the DC passing ports of the splitters to the desired LNBF(s).
Winegard PS-9370 - Google Product Search
Now what?
The second ecoda worked fine for 5 days before it stoped switching to the 22k side. So I switched that lnb to the off side just to make sure it was the switch, and it was. Then I put it back were it was, and its working again. Now I don't know if its the switch or my setup. Could I have to much conected to my receiver? There is a motor and 4 lnbs, 1 diseqc and the ecoda.
The second ecoda worked fine for 5 days before it stoped switching to the 22k side. So I switched that lnb to the off side just to make sure it was the switch, and it was. Then I put it back were it was, and its working again. Now I don't know if its the switch or my setup. Could I have to much conected to my receiver? There is a motor and 4 lnbs, 1 diseqc and the ecoda.
22KHz switches occasionally get confused. We have found by powering off the receiver Master Power for a few minutes then repowering in 0KHz position then switching to the 22KHz position will correct the problem. Connecting only one side of the switch will also confuse the switching and temporarily "get stuck" in one of the positions.
technical considerations:
While I admire the improvements possible in boosting the LNB power output of the receiver . . .
- that puts an increased load on the receiver power supply, which it may or may not be rated for
- it will cause increased heating of the STB, which should be offset by an increase in cooling
- if a receiver has overcurrent protection beyond that supplied by the 315/317 regulator, you may run afoul of it
. . . and more importantly . . .
- the 300 ma power rating of the Ecoda switch was not addressed.
(It doesn't say 300 ma per leg, just 300ma, so one must assume 300ma overall)
I haven't seen a schematic of the Ecoda 22khz switch, so it's quite possible it'll handle 300 ma in both legs simultaneously.
Maybe for those so hell-bent on running two motors, we could come up with a mod that would guarantee 500ma per leg. -
A mod described several years ago, was to the H-H motors themselves.
It revolved around attaching a laptop power supply (source of 19..20 volts) directly to the motor.
It came about because many PCI cards could not drive motors so well.
As a result, the motor drew only around 50..100 ma from the coax for its electronics.
While we are at it, maybe we should find a sturdy diseqc switch.
Or better yet, modify one with bigger transistors and diodes to handle larger loads.
Their diode-switching design may not be conducive to handling large loads.
While I admire the improvements possible in boosting the LNB power output of the receiver . . .
- that puts an increased load on the receiver power supply, which it may or may not be rated for
- it will cause increased heating of the STB, which should be offset by an increase in cooling
- if a receiver has overcurrent protection beyond that supplied by the 315/317 regulator, you may run afoul of it
. . . and more importantly . . .
- the 300 ma power rating of the Ecoda switch was not addressed.
(It doesn't say 300 ma per leg, just 300ma, so one must assume 300ma overall)
I haven't seen a schematic of the Ecoda 22khz switch, so it's quite possible it'll handle 300 ma in both legs simultaneously.
Maybe for those so hell-bent on running two motors, we could come up with a mod that would guarantee 500ma per leg. -
A mod described several years ago, was to the H-H motors themselves.
It revolved around attaching a laptop power supply (source of 19..20 volts) directly to the motor.
It came about because many PCI cards could not drive motors so well.
As a result, the motor drew only around 50..100 ma from the coax for its electronics.
While we are at it, maybe we should find a sturdy diseqc switch.
Or better yet, modify one with bigger transistors and diodes to handle larger loads.
Their diode-switching design may not be conducive to handling large loads.
Didn't even need to get off my butt. Sometimes the solutions have already been provided. As a hobbyist, I would suggest that you might even consider wearing the Junior Engineer's Hat and honorary pocket protector!
A 30 second Google search yields more information:
Solution #1 Cost ...... as low as 29 cents and 10 minutes of your time.
lm317t - Google Product Search
- Unplug the STB
- Remove the cover
- Identify the 315 Power Regulator attached to a heat sink located near the tuner
- Remove screw securing Power Regulator to the Heat Sink
- Remove screws securing Motherboard to Chassis and if necessary, the screws and F-fitting nuts from any connections securing the motherboard connections to the rear panel.
- Desolder and remove the 315 Power Regulator
- Solder in the LM317t Power Regulator
- Secure the mother board to the chassis and the connections to the rear panel.
- Secure the LM317t to the heat sink (use heat sink compound for better performance).
- Replace the cover.
Your system now should be able to handle two motors and a few LNBFs.....
Solution #2 Cost ...... as low as $40 and an hour of your time. Install high frequency single port power passing splitter after each port of the 22KHz switch connect the DC blocked port to power inserters (similar to the Winegard PS-9370) and attach to the motors, connect the DC passing ports of the splitters to the desired LNBF(s).
Winegard PS-9370 - Google Product Search
Wow...
This engineer has been on the ball!
This is kinda over my head, as far as soldering on a motherboard...
I think I am better off pulling up one of the dishes and relocating it to a better location.
Oops! Wrong part number. The Winegard PS-1503 15vdc or the (Radio Shack equiv.) should do the trick. Would need to check if the port will pass DiSEqC commands. Used this method a few years ago for an install in Washington state. The gentleman recently passed, so wouldn't be able to confirm the specific part used. (No, he was not electrocuted by his FTA system!)
The Ecoda 2x1 switch will handle two SG2100 type motors without failing. Have used this configuration for our rooftop dish farm for several years. In our sample testing we have determined that these switches are rated far below the actual repetitive usage limits.
The Ecoda 2x1 switch will handle two SG2100 type motors without failing. Have used this configuration for our rooftop dish farm for several years. In our sample testing we have determined that these switches are rated far below the actual repetitive usage limits.
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Finally solved my problem
Don't know if it was luck, but two of the same lnbf's fixed my problem. My thought was since these switches pass power on both sides at the same time, if one lnbf was drawing more current than the other the other wouldn't work. I have no way to test the current however. Does this seam possible? Either way its worked flawlessly since I put two of the same lnbs on.
Don't know if it was luck, but two of the same lnbf's fixed my problem. My thought was since these switches pass power on both sides at the same time, if one lnbf was drawing more current than the other the other wouldn't work. I have no way to test the current however. Does this seam possible? Either way its worked flawlessly since I put two of the same lnbs on.
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