DRM / HDCP Cracked - could this be good news for consumers?
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I think there is a lot of confusion in this thread. How is HDMI somehow linked to the DRM?
Not sure I follow. If I record a movie or tv show, you arfe saying you object to my having the ability to put the recording either on my computer or place it on a DVD for future use? And you object to a simple method by which I can distribute that recording throughout my whole house system?
That's what I have thought about this. The protections of this type of property were limited to prohibiting distribution of said property.
I could make a thousand recordings of a movie or tv show or sporting event, so as long as I do not redistribute the material. For home use only.
If by "movie" you mean an encrypted DVD, you would not be correct. It is unlawful to even attempt to defeat the copy protection scheme (in the USA.)
I can't speak for what he meant by "movie". But whatever the movie is, sooner or later, you'll probably be able to record it from OTA with no flags set. I actually prefer some movies this way. I can VideoRedo out the ads, and I don't have to worry about as much embarassing or vulgar content.
Funny how you can record OTA & it's legal, but rip a DVD of the same movie & it's not. It's silly to me, but you're right, that's how it is.
Cheers
The difference is in the quality of the recording. In the case of a DVD or BD the (illegal) copy is at the same resolution as the original. 480p for the DVD and 1080p for a BD movie.
In the case of the unencrypted OTA offering, one must down-rez via analog output in order to copy.
dishcomm said:
No. I'm saying distributing copies to others is wrong, regardless of self serving excuses.
That is most definitely not true. ATSC PC tuners can record the OTA digital stream direct to disk unaltered. I do it all the time.
As do I. The resulting recording even contains the CCs, which after a little VideoRedo magic, can even be converted to *.srt files if you convert to *.avi (or other format). Or, you can just view the original CCs without any video conversion (in HD if it was broadcast that way). This was the #2 reason for me building my HTPC (#1 was DVB sports wildfeeds).
Yeah, the real difference is that the Hollywood lobby hasn't figured out a way to mess with digital OTA that wouldn't cause too big of an uproar.
Cheers
Doh. Of course it's true. My Dish receiver can also record that as well as many other devices. We are talking about making copies not storing the original.!
I store my BD disk on a shelf. I can store my down-rezzed copy on a PC or a DVD or elsewhere. I keep my 1080 pirated BD copy well hidden. Kapeesh?
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The big guys are slow to get this. The music industry is almost dead because they fought technology. Now, the label is almost unneccessary. Physical media in music will be gone in another 5 years. I program two radio stations. I don't even get CD's to give away to my listeners... I get download codes.
That will take longer in video, because the files are large. I love my windows media center PC. I stream all content via my xbox 360's at home. If I want something, I buy it and I make a copy of it. You can say it's illegal all day, but I never share the copy and I put my original in my media 'closet'. It is for my personal use and really convenience.
That will take longer in video, because the files are large. I love my windows media center PC. I stream all content via my xbox 360's at home. If I want something, I buy it and I make a copy of it. You can say it's illegal all day, but I never share the copy and I put my original in my media 'closet'. It is for my personal use and really convenience.
Don't misunderstand, I'm not the media police nor do I even care who copies what,but there is no "you can say it's illegal." It is illegal as a matter of law.
I agree completely with your post - in not too many years the DVD and BD will have gone the way of the vinyl platter. And yes, the video industry will fight it til the end - to the detriment of both the industry and also we consumers. But current bootleg copies are illegally made.
Okay, i can't help but chime in because people seem to think this whole digital copy thing is black and white. (pardon the pun)
Now, the movie industry hated the invention of instant replay back in the 60's, they REALLY hated the invention of the VCR (with integrated tuners!) in the 70's, but never really tried to lobby it because there were too many other loopholes. (some days i miss analog)
Then came the digital revolution. DVDs had to be encrypted, and that was defeated. BD player keys, defeated. Now the master key for HDCP which will ALLOW for a "Man-in-the-middle" copy scheme. They really don't like this... it screws up EVERYTHING. Because distributing on disc is one thing, they know it's expensive, they know people will figure out how to copy it. "If man can make it, man can most certainly break it." It even screws up the next generation of "on-demand" delivery. Streaming, because it can now be sucked off the once-thought secure interface. They don't even have to BUY a copy of it anymore! Ut oh!
NOW, the real point people seem to be forgetting is that the MPAA/RIAA shot themselves in the foot a LONG time ago. Go read those documents. Digital media (be it movie, data, music, whatever), is licensed, not purchased. HOWEVER, because of possible defects and the venerable knowledge that physical media WILL go bad, you are allowed ONE BACKUP COPY of any digital media you "license".
Oops.
Of course there's provisions in there, not for public display, not for resale, cannot turn profit, non-transferable, etc. BUT, you are allowed one backup per license you purchase. It's funny that DRM actually PREVENTS you from creating this back up copy because they assume guilt.
I work in radio, i had a media lawyer explain this to me for $400 an hour. Worth every penny.
Now, the movie industry hated the invention of instant replay back in the 60's, they REALLY hated the invention of the VCR (with integrated tuners!) in the 70's, but never really tried to lobby it because there were too many other loopholes. (some days i miss analog)
Then came the digital revolution. DVDs had to be encrypted, and that was defeated. BD player keys, defeated. Now the master key for HDCP which will ALLOW for a "Man-in-the-middle" copy scheme. They really don't like this... it screws up EVERYTHING. Because distributing on disc is one thing, they know it's expensive, they know people will figure out how to copy it. "If man can make it, man can most certainly break it." It even screws up the next generation of "on-demand" delivery. Streaming, because it can now be sucked off the once-thought secure interface. They don't even have to BUY a copy of it anymore! Ut oh!
NOW, the real point people seem to be forgetting is that the MPAA/RIAA shot themselves in the foot a LONG time ago. Go read those documents. Digital media (be it movie, data, music, whatever), is licensed, not purchased. HOWEVER, because of possible defects and the venerable knowledge that physical media WILL go bad, you are allowed ONE BACKUP COPY of any digital media you "license".
Oops.
Of course there's provisions in there, not for public display, not for resale, cannot turn profit, non-transferable, etc. BUT, you are allowed one backup per license you purchase. It's funny that DRM actually PREVENTS you from creating this back up copy because they assume guilt.
I work in radio, i had a media lawyer explain this to me for $400 an hour. Worth every penny.
I don't want a 'code' that will copy whole blu ray disks... I want a code that will let you BYPASS ALL THE PREVIEW CRAP AND GET RIGHT TO THE MOVIE!!
I believe this part of the law is why Dish (and others) get away with building DVRs, and why Dish allows you to move, but not copy the "one backup copy" on the internal drive. Obviously if it's moved, it remains the "one backup copy".
goobenet said:Okay, i can't help but chime in because people seem to think this whole digital copy thing is black and white. (pardon the pun)
Now, the movie industry hated the invention of instant replay back in the 60's, they REALLY hated the invention of the VCR (with integrated tuners!) in the 70's, but never really tried to lobby it because there were too many other loopholes. (some days i miss analog)
Then came the digital revolution. DVDs had to be encrypted, and that was defeated. BD player keys, defeated. Now the master key for HDCP which will ALLOW for a "Man-in-the-middle" copy scheme. They really don't like this... it screws up EVERYTHING. Because distributing on disc is one thing, they know it's expensive, they know people will figure out how to copy it. "If man can make it, man can most certainly break it." It even screws up the next generation of "on-demand" delivery. Streaming, because it can now be sucked off the once-thought secure interface. They don't even have to BUY a copy of it anymore! Ut oh!
NOW, the real point people seem to be forgetting is that the MPAA/RIAA shot themselves in the foot a LONG time ago. Go read those documents. Digital media (be it movie, data, music, whatever), is licensed, not purchased. HOWEVER, because of possible defects and the venerable knowledge that physical media WILL go bad, you are allowed ONE BACKUP COPY of any digital media you "license".
Oops.
Of course there's provisions in there, not for public display, not for resale, cannot turn profit, non-transferable, etc. BUT, you are allowed one backup per license you purchase. It's funny that DRM actually PREVENTS you from creating this back up copy because they assume guilt.
I work in radio, i had a media lawyer explain this to me for $400 an hour. Worth every penny.
Speaking of radio and copy protection. Remember when we would get copies of full CD's in the mail with the big sticker that said 'for your convenience, this is NOT copy protected'?
We rebelled when they were sending us CD's that we couldn't rip into our automation and dropped all of a certain labels songs. That ended that real fast. Of course now everything is watermarked, but at least I get to download a wav instead of an mp3.
Yeah, we stopped taking Sony discs too.
We're actually kinda pissed that we don't get CDs anymore from a lot of labels. They all want us to go to myspace and get them from there... they seem to think that audio quality is universal. This is our new fight. Dumbasses who think 24khz mono tracks are just as good as the CD cut...
(BTW, i'm an engineer, the PDs worst nightmare, and best friend.
)
I'm a PD of two and IT Manager for the building. PD was an accident. IT was by choice. I do program the top two stations in town, though.
We run all linear. Most of the labels at this point either offer a direct .wav download or contract it out to a PlayMPE, etc... If a PD is telling you a label is sending him to myspace, he is full of ****. They don't do that. He probably just wants you to make him a bunch of holes in the firewall, so he can do something other than his job.
We run all linear. Most of the labels at this point either offer a direct .wav download or contract it out to a PlayMPE, etc... If a PD is telling you a label is sending him to myspace, he is full of ****. They don't do that. He probably just wants you to make him a bunch of holes in the firewall, so he can do something other than his job.
