Down to Basics, please

[Dreamer]

I've been reading many of the posts here for novices, and I find that many of the intelligent, well-meaning people here fall into the same trap that I experience as a math teacher - I start using language that is famililar and basic to me but a complete mystery to my audience.

I'd like some advice, please, about the Free-to-Air possibilities that any new person (such as myself) with little technical knowlege could benefit by reading.

Here's the situation: I live in a remote part of Arkansas on a homestead. We are too far from anywhere (and too hilly) to get any local TV on an antenna. We have a lot of room and a clear view of the southern sky, so are currently on DISH Network with local channels. We have a 500 configuration (dual detectors at the dish) although we are only subscribing with one receiver. We don't watch enough channels to make the $30 a month worth it, but we do like sports, news, music, and classic movies.

We don't want to pirate any transmissions, but we would like to know if we can use our existing dish and detector to pick up any FTA programming. I think we own the dish, etc. after our contract expires in January. It looks like the addition of an FTA receiver like the Pansat 2500 would be needed. I don't understand what all the other designations are (switches, etc.) What all does a person need without becoming a SAT techie?

Thanks in advance for any help. I know that a person who answers this thread has a lot of patience and cares about helping.

 

[PSB]

You are not dreamimg! I agree with you 100% I try my best to tell it like it is and leave out the big words and I like to think all the "members" here enjoy helping people new to the hobby, and remember dreamer thats what it is right now FTA cant be considered a service quite yet.
Your Dish 500 will let you pull in a few nice channels and radio stations, but if you are going to go to all this bother you would be as well getting a KU dish at the same time as the receiver, the same can be said about a motor it really is a must to realise your Free to air DVB systems full potential.

The systems I recommend come with everything you need, a DVB receiver, a 90cm dish, a Universal LNBF, and a self install kit, and if required a motor.
There are all sorts of radio channels and one music video channel (The Tube) so that should take care of your music needs.
As for classic TV and movies I think "The Peoples Network" will take care of that, its all American "SAFE" TV and also has the Chuck Harder and Howard Hewes shows that are fast becoming cult shows for us FTA junkies (not me I can take it or leave it, I don't need it, its not controlling me....)
As for sports there are all sorts of sports feeds popping up mainly over the weekends, but don't expect an exact game and sport, as we have come to realise with FTA you take what you get. But there are more than enough games and events for me FTA.
I particularly like the news feeds, you are right there where ever the news is in the country or indeed the world LIVE!
I think the main selling point of this hobby is the networks, right now we have all the nations network channels FTA, the come from different areas of the country but they all have the same shows as your local channels only the news differs, right now we even have a few AR local channels FTA : )
In conclusion I would say you are the perfect example of a person who can save himself $30 a month and still enjoy digital TV at its best and have the perfect hobby to keep you amused and entertained for a long time to come, welcome to our world : )

What you can expect to get with a small Dish 500 satellite dish (legacy)

http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=25452

What you need for FTA DVB.....

http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=26237

 

[Mr Tony]

I've been reading many of the posts here for novices, and I find that many of the intelligent, well-meaning people here fall into the same trap that I experience as a math teacher - I start using language that is famililar and basic to me but a complete mystery to my audience.

welcome I will try not to use all the freaky lingo to confuse you

I'd like some advice, please, about the Free-to-Air possibilities that any new person (such as myself) with little technical knowlege could benefit by reading.

I will try my best

Here's the situation: I live in a remote part of Arkansas on a homestead. We are too far from anywhere (and too hilly) to get any local TV on an antenna. We have a lot of room and a clear view of the southern sky, so are currently on DISH Network with local channels. We have a 500 configuration (dual detectors at the dish) although we are only subscribing with one receiver. We don't watch enough channels to make the $30 a month worth it, but we do like sports, news, music, and classic movies.

We don't want to pirate any transmissions, but we would like to know if we can use our existing dish and detector to pick up any FTA programming. I think we own the dish, etc. after our contract expires in January. It looks like the addition of an FTA receiver like the Pansat 2500 would be needed. I don't understand what all the other designations are (switches, etc.) What all does a person need without becoming a SAT techie?

Thanks in advance for any help. I know that a person who answers this thread has a lot of patience and cares about helping.

A dish 500 will get you some free to air stuff. Mostly barker channels. Here is a simple list of what you could get with a Dish500
-Dish 101
-NASA
-Angel One
-The muzak audio channels

not much there (althought the audio ones are good). You could also move that dish to ExpressVu's satellite (Evu is a Canadian provider) and get radio from Canada including the CBC (which rules in my mind)

most of the FTA (free to air) stuff uses KU band. Dish & Direct use DBS. KU band uses a dish at least 30". You might remember C-Band, which was the huge honkin dishes. Alot of channels have decided to use the smaller dish, allowing a larger viewing audience.

The LNB (low noise blocker) is the "eye". It collects the signal and sends it to your receiver. To pick up FTA, you need at least a 30" dish (the larger the better) and a KU band LNB. Since KU is lower powered than Dish Network, you need a larger dish

You can add a motor if you'd like. There are probably 20 satellites out there that have programs (some have one channel, some have 100). The motor allows you to enhance your viewing by "motoring" to the satellites. It is optional, but highly recommended.

So all you need to get going is a receiver, dish and LNB and some cable.

Now..programming....On one of the satellites, Galaxy 10, there are networks from around the country, and actually a lot from Arkansas. On this one satellite, I can get 4 WB networks, 5 UPN's, 2 ABC's, 1 CBS, 2 FOX, and 1 PAX. The only one that isnt here is NBC. Some of the nets here are actually from Fayetteville/Ft Smith/Little Rock area Kinda cool for you. HEre are the AR networks there
KWBF WB Little Rock
KYPX PAX Camden
KFDF UPN Ft Smith
KPBI FOX Ft Smith
KLRA Univision Little Rock
The ABC is from Cheyenne, WY

The best part of some receivers are a "blind scan" or "smart scan". Normally, you would have to program in the info to pick it up. Not anymore, hit one button and it scans the satellite for all the stuff that nobody knows about. There are tons of sports on there. Alot of the games are beamed via satellite from the arena to the studio. We can pick those up. I was just watching Arkansas basketball last night on the local channel. (and I live in MN). Usually a couple of times a night (and more on weekends) I scan the 2 big "sports" satellites to see what is new. You never know what you'll see

and the best part is its all FREE!!!! You pay for the equipment and thats it! Now I will warn, that stuff comes and goes all the time (the networks have been there for almost 2 years now). There is one satellite that has mostly international channels (Arabic, Chinese) and one that has news feeds and stuff.

It is a great hobby

Welcome aboard!

 

[carload]

I enjoy FTA as much as anyone, but I can't casually recommend it as an alternative to pay TV, especially in a location without locals.

Remember that very few of these channels are being beamed down with you in mind. They come and go, which can be fun and exciting as long as that doesn't prevent you from seeing the last episode of Survivor or something.

There will be certain sporting events you won't be able to see without ESPN. Other sports will be available here and there; will they be an adequate substitute for you?

Certain educational networks (Discovery, TLC) will be unavailable. Other educational networks are currently on Ku-band; will they be adequate substitutes for your family?

As far as movies go, I figure that you could buy a public domain set every month or two and have a decent substitute for classic movie channels. If there's a nearby library or DVD rental outlet, you can roll your own movie channel.

If you and your family can handle this humble, opportunistic way of watching TV, it can be kind of fun, and it's definitely cheaper.

WHAT YOU NEED: I'd start with a good receiver -- a Fortec, Pansat or something else that supports digital audio (for the PBS stations) and can drive a motor. But I wouldn't start with a motor. I'd get a Ku-band dish/LNB and point it at Galaxy 10R. Once you've got everything working, then you can consider easily adding a motor to sweep the skies.

If you want to keep your Dish Network dish/LNB, you can use it for Canadian radio or some other niche. To leave both your Ku band dish and the Dish Network dish plugged into your receiver, you'll need a DiSEqc switch; I got mine on eBay for less than $10 delivered.

With a good receiver, Ku band dish/LNB, the cables, the switch and delivery, budget about $300 for the project. (Budget another $100 once you decide to add the motor.) You might get a deal for a little less.

And read, read, read! There's a lot of FTA info on the net, but most of it's scattered. My favorite starting point is here: http://www.global-cm.net/mpeg2central.html

Good luck!

 

[Dreamer]

Thanks PSB, Iceberg, and carload for the good, understandable replies. I'm thinking of getting a PanSat 2500, 3 foot dish, and LNB at the first of the year. I'll set it all up for Galaxy 10R then add a motor later.

In looking over what is available on Galaxy 10R I notice that some programs are listed as DVB, NTSC and some as Digicipher 2. Does that indicate that the programs are encoded in some way? Do I need a decoder?

 

[PSB]

You will get most of the DVB channels, KU band Freq. have 5 digits and C band have four, so for now you will only be able to get KU channels, without a lot of extra spending.

http://www.dmsiusa.com/charts.htm

 

[Dreamer]

Are you saying that NTSC and Digicipher II are C band?

 

[PSB]

Digicipher is an encyption method and NTSC is a TV format, the way to tell C and KU is KU 5 digits/ C 4 digits.

 

[neil_kc1]

Dreamer like you I am a total novice at this stuff. But with the telephone help of the guy who sold my my system, I self installed, after trying for 2 weeks with nothing, located my first signal. Today i have 195 channels and feeds loaded in memory on about 12 different satellites. I have cut both the cabel cord and the dish/direct tv cords. and love the adventure. BE SURE YOU GET A BLIND SCAN RECEIVER! and one that moves your dish. right now G-10 is kinda spotty, due to high winds moving my dish, but most of the other satellites are clear as a bell. good luck

 

[PSB]

Nice story neil kc1, there is less and less on pay TV worth the money IMO : )

 

[tvdxer]

I've been reading many of the posts here for novices, and I find that many of the intelligent, well-meaning people here fall into the same trap that I experience as a math teacher - I start using language that is famililar and basic to me but a complete mystery to my audience.

I'd like some advice, please, about the Free-to-Air possibilities that any new person (such as myself) with little technical knowlege could benefit by reading.

Here's the situation: I live in a remote part of Arkansas on a homestead. We are too far from anywhere (and too hilly) to get any local TV on an antenna. We have a lot of room and a clear view of the southern sky, so are currently on DISH Network with local channels. We have a 500 configuration (dual detectors at the dish) although we are only subscribing with one receiver. We don't watch enough channels to make the $30 a month worth it, but we do like sports, news, music, and classic movies.

We don't want to pirate any transmissions, but we would like to know if we can use our existing dish and detector to pick up any FTA programming. I think we own the dish, etc. after our contract expires in January. It looks like the addition of an FTA receiver like the Pansat 2500 would be needed. I don't understand what all the other designations are (switches, etc.) What all does a person need without becoming a SAT techie?

Thanks in advance for any help. I know that a person who answers this thread has a lot of patience and cares about helping.

Your current dish and detector (in satellite lingo we call it an "LNB") will not be useful for much in the FTA world, other than some other channels Dish has not elected to scramble, as a previous poster/s has mentioned. In AR an 80-90 cm dish with a horizon-horizon motor (a device that automatically re-positions the dish when you want to change satellites) will bring a FTA receiver a great number of channels. However, not many of them will be "typical" services - there's a plethora of international TV (currently, everything from Bosnian to Vietnamese to Kurdish to Dutch), a number of network affiliates, "distance learning" and PBS-type educational TV, and some other stuff as well. You'll also be able to see special "backhauls" or news/event feeds used by networks, etc. It's a "behind-the-scenes" sort of thing, you could say.

An FTA system will not provide you with the services you are currently getting from Dish, in the same way that Dish simply cannot provide you with the enjoyment that FTA gives you.

 

[ken2400]

The only thing I would add is to buy a signal meter and a compus(sp). Also there are some programes out there that will give you all the locations of the sats for your area. It would start soon so you will have something up and running before your sub runs out. Before long you too will have a dish farm.

Even when you get the chans you want the boss is still right. "56 chans and nothing on" So turn on the radio. There is a lot of that on sat too.

Good luck and keep us posted.
Ken

 

[PSB]

Good Idea Ken, Tom give us your zip code (or Latitude and Longitude) and we will give you all the "look" angles you will ever need! The only one you REALLY need if you add a motor is your true south satellite, when your dish and motor are properly set up this is the only satellite you need to aim at then everything else is done by the remote control from indoors : )

 

[Dreamer]

Thanks guys. Zip is 72687.

 

[PSB]

Yellville, AR 72687
Latitude 36° 13.518'N Longitude 92° 43.470'W

Sat Name Sat Lng Az(t) Az(m) El Skew
-------------------------------------------------------------
*** Of Particular Interest ***

EchoStar 3 61.5W 134.3 132.2 36.6 -35.3
EchoStar 6 110.0W 207.8 205.7 44.2 22.1
EchoStar 8 110.0W 207.8 205.7 44.2 22.1
EchoStar 7 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1
EchoStar 5 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1
EchoStar 9/Telstar 13 121.0W 222.3 220.2 38.5 32.9
EchoStar 1 148.0W 247.7 245.7 19.1 48.3
EchoStar 2 148.0W 247.7 245.7 19.1 48.3
EchoStar 4 157.0W 254.1 252.0 12.0 50.9

DirecTV 3 81.8W 161.9 159.8 46.4 -14.5
DirecTV 2 100.8W 193.5 191.4 47.1 10.9
DirecTV 1R 100.8W 193.5 191.4 47.1 10.9
DirecTV 1 101.0W 193.8 191.8 47.1 11.1
DirecTV 4S 101.2W 194.2 192.1 47.0 11.4
DirecTV 6 109.8W 207.5 205.4 44.2 21.8
DirecTV 5 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1

*** All Satellites 61W - 160W ***

EchoStar 3 61.5W 134.3 132.2 36.6 -35.3
Rainbow 1 61.5W 134.3 132.2 36.6 -35.3
Brasilsat A2 (incl. 5.8 deg) 63.0W 136.0 133.9 37.6 -34.1
Brasilsat B2 65.0W 138.4 136.3 38.8 -32.4
Brasilsat B1 70.0W 144.7 142.6 41.6 -27.8
Nahuel 1 71.8W 147.1 145.0 42.5 -26.0
AMC 6 72.0W 147.4 145.3 42.6 -25.8
Galaxy 12 74.0W 150.2 148.1 43.5 -23.7
SBS 6 74.0W 150.2 148.1 43.5 -23.7
GOES 12 75.0W 151.6 149.5 44.0 -22.6
AMC 5 79.0W 157.5 155.5 45.5 -17.9
DirecTV 3 81.8W 161.9 159.8 46.4 -14.5
Nimiq 2 82.0W 162.2 160.2 46.4 -14.3
Brasilsat B3 84.0W 165.4 163.4 47.0 -11.7
XM Roll 85.0W 167.1 165.0 47.2 -10.4
AMC 9 85.0W 167.1 165.0 47.2 -10.4
AMC 3 87.0W 170.4 168.3 47.5 -7.8
Galaxy 11 91.0W 177.1 175.0 47.9 -2.4
Nimiq 1 91.0W 177.1 175.0 47.9 -2.4
Brasilsat B4 92.0W 178.8 176.7 48.0 -1.0
Telstar 6 93.0W 180.5 178.4 48.0 0.4 TRUE SOUTH
Galaxy 8I (incl. 1.0 deg) 95.0W 183.8 181.8 47.9 3.1
Galaxy 3C 95.0W 183.8 181.8 47.9 3.1
Telstar 5 97.0W 187.2 185.1 47.7 5.8
Inmarsat 2 f2 (incl. 1.7 deg) 98.0W 188.9 186.8 47.6 7.2
Galaxy 4R 99.0W 190.5 188.5 47.4 8.5
DirecTV 2 100.8W 193.5 191.4 47.1 10.9
DirecTV 1R 100.8W 193.5 191.4 47.1 10.9
AMC 4 101.0W 193.8 191.8 47.1 11.1
DirecTV 1 101.0W 193.8 191.8 47.1 11.1
AMSC 1 101.1W 194.0 191.9 47.0 11.2
DirecTV 4S 101.2W 194.2 192.1 47.0 11.4
AMC 1 103.0W 197.1 195.0 46.6 13.7
Solidaridad 1 (incl. 2.8 deg) 103.5W 197.9 195.8 46.4 14.3
AMC 2 105.0W 200.2 198.1 46.0 16.2
G-Star 3 (incl. 11.5 deg) 105.0W 200.2 198.1 46.0 16.2
G-Star 1 (incl. 6.0 deg) 105.0W 200.2 198.1 46.0 16.2
MSAT 1 106.5W 202.5 200.5 45.5 18.0
Anik F1 107.3W 203.7 201.7 45.2 19.0
Anik E1 109.2W 206.6 204.5 44.5 21.2
DirecTV 6 109.8W 207.5 205.4 44.2 21.8
EchoStar 6 110.0W 207.8 205.7 44.2 22.1
EchoStar 8 110.0W 207.8 205.7 44.2 22.1
Anik E2R 111.1W 209.3 207.3 43.7 23.3
Solidaridad 2 113.0W 212.0 209.9 42.8 25.3
Morelos 2 (incl. 4.4 deg) 114.9W 214.6 212.5 41.9 27.3
XM Rock 115.0W 214.7 212.7 41.8 27.4
SatMex 5 116.8W 217.1 215.0 40.9 29.1
Anik E2 118.7W 219.5 217.4 39.8 30.9
DirecTV 5 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1
EchoStar 7 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1
EchoStar 5 119.0W 219.9 217.8 39.6 31.1
EchoStar 9/Telstar 13 121.0W 222.3 220.2 38.5 32.9
Galaxy 10R 123.0W 224.6 222.6 37.2 34.5
Galaxy 5 125.0W 226.9 224.8 36.0 36.1
Galaxy 9 127.0W 229.1 227.0 34.7 37.6
Telstar 7 129.0W 231.2 229.1 33.3 38.9
Satcom C3 131.0W 233.2 231.1 31.9 40.2
Galaxy 1R 133.0W 235.1 233.0 30.5 41.4
Satcom C4 135.0W 237.0 234.9 29.0 42.6
GOES 10 135.5W 237.4 235.4 28.7 42.8
AMC 7 137.0W 238.8 236.7 27.6 43.6
AMC 8 139.0W 240.5 238.4 26.1 44.6
Inmarsat 2 f3 (incl. 1.9 deg) 142.0W 243.0 241.0 23.8 46.0
EchoStar 1 148.0W 247.7 245.7 19.1 48.3
EchoStar 2 148.0W 247.7 245.7 19.1 48.3
TDRS 9 (incl. 7.4 deg) 151.0W 249.9 247.9 16.8 49.3
TDRS 10 (incl. 6.2 deg) 151.0W 249.9 247.9 16.8 49.3
EchoStar 4 157.0W 254.1 252.0 12.0 50.9