DISH Network Retailer Chat Recap - "Hopper Special" - 2/16/2012

[Stargazer]

If Dish ends up making you take a minimum number of Joeys before taking a second Hopper then I don't want it period. They are being very restrictive at that point for those that need to deal with timer conflicts and I guarantee that will cost them business.

 

[navychop]

I really don't think Dish will require us to take a minimum number of Joeys. Being human, in the absence of firm information, we're coming up with things to worry about.

Hmmm- if Dish required you to have at least one Joey if you had two Hoppers, that would be a real deterrent to moving to H/J.

 

[KAB]

I really don't think Dish will require us to take a minimum number of Joeys. Being human, in the absence of firm information, we're coming up with things to worry about.

Even with information, people still find (or invent) things to worry about.

 

[JM42]

I really don't think Dish will require us to take a minimum number of Joeys. Being human, in the absence of firm information, we're coming up with things to worry about.

Hmmm- if Dish required you to have at least one Joey if you had two Hoppers, that would be a real deterrent to moving to H/J.

A Joey requirement is almost impossible to enforce. What would they do if you call up two weeks after install and want to drop a Joey? Make you return the 2nd Hopper instead when you paid the $199 up front? Anything is possible but I just don't see them doing that.

 

[dare2be]

Even with information, people still find (or invent) things to worry about.

You mean like the retailer estimate sheet?

 

[dishrich]

Choice on Direct looks like at least as many channels as Dish Silver and their "extras" pkg if $5/mo vs. $10 for Platinum (altho Dish would offer the movies by mail)
I think for $131, I may have talked myself in to it.. have I missed anything on the pricing? PDF attached.

Uh, have you compared how many (basic) HD channels you're actually going to be LOOSING by switching to D*?
Since you specifically mentioned getting HD connections on the other 2 sets - if the channels you currently watch NOW on E*, are in SD ONLY on D*, then what HAVE you gained by switching???

 

[zim2dive]

Uh, have you compared how many (basic) HD channels you're actually going to be LOOSING by switching to D*?
Since you specifically mentioned getting HD connections on the other 2 sets - if the channels you currently watch NOW on E*, are in SD ONLY on D*, then what HAVE you gained by switching???

Yes, I *have* compared.. have you? Again, I am comparing Dish America Silver to Direct Choice.

Dish Silver gains: CNBC, LifetimeMovie, NBA,
Direct Choice gains: ABCFam, AMC, ESPN3D, ESPNU, Disney, FoxNews, FX, Hallmark, HDNetMovies, NatGeo, Nick, VH1

thats what I see from a quick comparison... and I skipped a few potentially throw-away channels that I wasn't familiar with (3net, Audience, etc which tip things even more in favor of Direct)..

point being.. do YOU know what channels you are missing? I made it very clear I was comparing Dish Silver vs. Direct Choice.

 

[dishrich]

Yes, I *have* compared.. have you? Again, I am comparing Dish America Silver to Direct Choice.

Uh yea, I DO get it & DO understand the differences; don't have to get huffy.
Just saying the grass is NOT always greener. (TOO aware of that as well, which leads me to...)

and I skipped a few potentially throw-away channels that I wasn't familiar with (3net, Audience, etc which tip things even more in favor of Direct)..

Trust me, you'll be thowing that AUD ch away as well...

point being.. do YOU know what channels you are missing?

POINT taken...& PAINFULLY aware what I'm missing - to the point of taking a serious look@E* & dumping D* altogether...
But in taking my own advice...worried about that other (manuer) pasture.

 

[zim2dive]

Uh yea, I DO get it & DO understand the differences; don't have to get huffy.
Just saying the grass is NOT always greener. (TOO aware of that as well, which leads me to...)

Sorry but you did rather imply I hadn't done my homework and would be stuck with lots of SD channels I really do want to have a very objective discussion.. I like Dish, I've been happy with Dish (4-5 years at this point) but am feeling like my original reasons for picking Dish (price) have largely gone the way of the Dodo.... and I freely admit I may have overlooked something in the pricing (and if anyone sees something, PLEASE point it out)... but at the end of the day, it all comes down to price for me. I may send my SS to retention and see if they want to work something out, and life is pretty busy (baby due in <2 months), but am betting I'll be a Direct sub by summer-time (getting my sis a $100 referral bonus at the same time).

agreed, 3net definitely looks toss-away (and ESPN3D, I don't have, nor plan to waste my $4 buying a 3DTV). For me, of the channels I watch, ESPNU is the only real plus (b/c my favorite team is too mediocre to get on ESPN 1,2 ), and the wife would like having AMC. And since I haven't heard wonderful things about the BBO service, getting the Direct Extra pack for $5, is $5/cheaper vs. what was the Dish Platinum channels, so I can get Universal back, and a couple of the 2nd-tier movie channels.

I'm just amazed/shocked that Dish would end up being no cheaper than Direct for the new setup. I always thought that was their draw (still bitter about losing my Absolute, that was a fantastic deal). I think Dish really missed the boat with their new pricing.

I also admit that 2 years down the road, I will probably have to switch again, b/c there is a $10/mo incentive even on the 2nd 12 months of Direct which would then expire. So maybe then I'll be back.

Or I may just drop down to Dish Latino (wife insists we get Bravo), save $5/mo vs. Silver, and keep the 622.. but the relevance to this thread is that the Hopper/Joey pricing is nothing wonderful for the consumer, and Dish is losing the pricing edge that drew many of us to them. If that's no longer their marketing goal, so be it, I wish them luck. Its not that I will suddenly dislike Dish, its just that I will no longer feel they offer me a clear advantage vs. Direct.

for all these companies (including TWC), the DVR "fees" are becoming silly (esp since you can't? get a Hopper without also paying the $4/mo whole house fee). Its as stupid as the airlines.. they try to cut the "fares" they advertise, and then sneak in the revenue via "fees". As a consumer, I find it insulting. Just show me the bottom-line price. I'll figure it out either way, but I'm more likely to respect the company which doesn't over-complicate it. They are all in the razor vs. razor-blade game.. they think you won't notice the recurring expenses (ie. the monthly cost/fee) if they make the initial cost (the razor) low.

Me, again, I'm in it for the value.. when I realize I can get 2 more TVs with HD for the next 2 years, for ~$6/month by switching to DirectTV.. that is compelling. Seeing that it cost me $400 (on top of the $130) to do the same with Dish...that is disappointing.

 

[Mike_H]

Biggest issue I see is Dish seems to be stuck following the pack rather than leading it when it comes to pricing. There was a time when folks were actively battling to get dish antennas installed on all sorts of properties because the value proposition was so good, even with the hassle of complicated installs. These days, dish is hurting their expansion by continually working to nickle and dime existing and potential customers, such that when new installs weigh their options, dish can often come up short. I don't know if this latest strategy allows them higher revenues long term, but it sure seems that the Hopper system is designed to slightly bump up subscriber revenue again, while decreasing unit install costs.

 

[Mr Tony]

Also important to note that DTV's new fee structure would be $38 ($20 ARS plus $6 per additional outlet).

sorry but you're wrong...Its $28. There is a $10 credit for the HD portion of that $20 fee

 

[Mr Tony]

getting the Direct Extra pack for $5, is $5/cheaper vs. what was the Dish Platinum channels, so I can get Universal back, and a couple of the 2nd-tier movie channels.

there's a way to save that $5 too every 3 months

 

[dare2be]

sorry but you're wrong...Its $28. There is a $10 credit for the HD portion of that $20 fee

But what about after the first 24 months?

 

[Mr Tony]

But what about after the first 24 months?

when you get to that bridge, then ask
Seriously...in 2 years you call Directv and they'll probably give you more credits to offset it.

 

[digitalblue]

sorry but you're wrong...Its $28. There is a $10 credit for the HD portion of that $20 fee

Only for two years, then the full ARS fee of $20/mo is applied. DIRECTV informed all retailers they are no longer offering HD Free For Life, but instead will now include HD programming as part of the ARS fee. All customers acquired and installed as of 2/9/12 will be subject to the new ARS fee.

Also, we don't play the "maybe" game with customers. Meaning telling customers to call and threaten to leave and they might give you more discounts. It get's old and tiresome, and is not in any way guaranteed to work. Plus, DTV made it perfectly clear to retailers that they can no longer afford to continue offering HD Free For Life, so they might give you a discount, they might not. From a retailer standpoint my exposure to churn in the third year is much higher with DTV than DISH given the current pricing enviroment.

The attached PDF details the pricing progression of both DISH and DIRECTV over a three year term using an HR34/H25 configuration for DTV and a Hopper/Joey configuration for DISH. I had to make an adjustment from my previous chart because I did not take into account that medium risk customers are not eligible for the second year programming discount. The reason I show a three year progression is because retailers are now held to a 3 year churn requirement by both providers.

The bigger question is what will happen on 3/15 when, according to the promotion guidelines, DTV's second year savings will be eliminated (although I'm unsure if that applies to the second year ARS fee discount too) and DISH is releasing the Hopper.

View attachment DTV vs DISH.pdf

 

[Laddyboy]

I wonder why Direct is getting so tight all of a sudden. Dish will look quite a bit cheaper unless they also really hike rates next year.

 

[lparsons21]

Pure guesswork on my part, but the reason D* may be tightening is that the programming cost may have gone up more than we all thought. When you look at the new customer prices and channels in the packages they get, you can see that compared to us existing customer, they are paying more and getting a fair bit less for it. Where we are paying more for the sub, we at least didn't lose as many channels in the lower tiers if we stay with a 'classic' sub.

 

[powerhouse1960]

I wonder why Direct is getting so tight all of a sudden. Dish will look quite a bit cheaper unless they also really hike rates next year.

And that's why all the price talk really does not matter much.
No one has a crystal ball when I got dish there was no dvr fee and only 7.00 for my second 722 one moth later I am paying 23 .00 for the same thing.I just want to see the end of my shows in hd in all of my rooms and dish cant do that now.

 

[zim2dive]

I wonder why Direct is getting so tight all of a sudden. Dish will look quite a bit cheaper unless they also really hike rates next year.

tight? can you explain?

from what I see on the Direct site, I can lock in my rate for 2 years (they probably leave themselves the same "fee loophole" as Dish.. so as someone leaning heavily towards switching, I'll avoid the Dish price increase which they are free to do in 2013 (they only promised not to raise in 2012)

 

[SmityWhity]

Haven't been active on SatelliteGuys for awhile, been too busy with other life functions. Was reading this thread about the Hopper and Joey, made it through page 39 and then jumped to the last page (52).

I see a lot of comments both pro and con, from posters I recognize and some I don't. There are a ton of "negative" comments about fees, most of which I feel the same way but will not come to a conclusion until I figure out what Hopper and Joey are. Some are necessary to stay in business, but we wonder about some fees. I guess the $4 whole house DVR fee with only a Hopper is actually a DVR fee that u pay one time for either just a Hopper or a Hopper and some Joey's. I would wonder if you need to pay that $4 for each Hopper; if so, then it really isn't a Whole House DVR Fee. I'll check some other threads shortly to find out more about all of this.

And now to the reason I'm posting.

I'm surprised at the negative comments towards Claude's posting where he basically took a particular scenario and summed it up. Although he was not pro something else on the posting (if I remember right), he was singled out as being pro something else by others, while no one else was singled out. Maybe he posted something elsewhere.

This is still a good site where you can get multiple opinions and then decide for yourself what works for you in your situation, not to mention the technical knowledge.

Oh, by the way, I first heard of the Hopper a few days ago from Claude.

Thanks Claude.

SW