DISH Network Retailer Chat Recap - "Hopper Special" - 2/16/2012

[dishrich]

Exactly you see the big picture. Not many on these boards see it. They are either DISH haters or DISH Pom Pom waivers.

Yep...& you can replace DISH with DirecTV, Comcast, U-verse, FiOS, etc. as well..

Perfect example...I am actually wanting to go to DISH for my "primary" programming pkg, since D* appears to keep sitting on it's dead ass in it's steadfast refusal to add any more HD basics. I'm also fed up with:
- what their "wonderful HD GUI" has done to all my HD DVR's to basically make them unusable (speed-wise),
- disabling NO simultaneous SD downconversion when you need on-screen displays - which has been a BIG problem NOT only for myself, but several of my D* clients with receiver (SD) backfeeds to secondary TV's
- NO OTA updates for their stupidly designed OTA tuners that don't scan...which means you cannot get any new/changed subchannels (I'm missing 2 right now)

I was actually waiting to see just how much potential the H/J might have for me. Well, THAT'S been nipped in the bud as things stand now - not to mention from a practical standpoint, would I EVER be a "beta-tester" on a brand-new, made-from-scratch E* receiver. (actually this would apply for ANY TV providers for me, including D*) So, if do decide to go to DISH, it'll probably be a 722 or two - but as it stands, definitely NOT this new thing!

 

[navychop]

"...all the negativity I see in the recent posts would dissappear..."


IMHO, no. It appears to me that some here would just find other things about Dish to complain about. There seems to be a determination in some to find fault with Dish.

If Hopper/Joey is a success, a year from now, will any of these folks that are saying it's a failure rethink their comments? Will they admit they were wrong? It's always safest to avoid absolute declarations, so if you're incorrect, you don't look so bad.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

"Aggressively "HIGH you mean.

Those were not my words.

Sent from my iPhone using SatelliteGuys

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

The nice part about all of this is that everyone has choices. You can get a Hopper or not. You can choose to go to Directv or cable or stay with dish.

Whatever the choice is the choice is yours to make and there is no wrong answer.

Now with that said Dish is watching so keep the comments coming good and bad.

Remember no ones opinion is correct, it's just their opinion.

Sent from my iPhone using SatelliteGuys

 

[MikeD-C05]

"...all the negativity I see in the recent posts would dissappear..."


IMHO, no. It appears to me that some here would just find other things about Dish to complain about. There seems to be a determination in some to find fault with Dish.

If Hopper/Joey is a success, a year from now, will any of these folks that are saying it's a failure rethink their comments? Will they admit they were wrong? It's always safest to avoid absolute declarations, so if you're incorrect, you don't look so bad.

One receiver comes to mind: 922. This was talked about in glowing terms and the end all be all receiver that DISH is pining all its hopes on. Everything was supposed to be about the 922 and you see how that turned out. This new hopper /joey system could of been great but they put FEES above everything else. Unless they reconsider their fee structure , I don't see this system being adopted any more than the 922 did. It is simply too high to charge $24.00 - $31.00 a month in FEES ,BEFORE programming is added to the mix.

The average family that has DISH ,chose them for their lower price in programming over DIRECTV and or cable. Why would you hit them with these higher made up , charge it because we can, DISH FEES too? Look at how the additional receiver fees of 2010, have kept DISH down in terms of sub growth. Next year, when taxes go back up & DISH has it's Price hike after this years " price freeze", and the price of gas will be up to $5.00 or higher a gallon. Do you think many potential subs will want to add all those extra FEES to their already higher programming pack too?

I forsee a failure in this system simply over price . The Wrong price ,at the wrong economic time. If I'm wrong and it all works out for the hopper, I will gladly say so. But I doubt I will have to say it. DISH has continued pushing their FEES & short term profits over any thing else, including the growth of their own company.

 

[MikeD-C05]

And my opinion is that from your posts here and in other threads, there isn't anything you like about Dish (including BB), not just the fees. Just making an observation that I have noticed. If you don't like or agree with that observation, then you are more than welcome not to read them. And my guess is that I'm not the only person that has noticed. But since you feel you were personally attacked, I have gone ahead and amended my previous post...
I guess I can understand your uncomfortableness of feeling attacked, I'm glad no one on this site has ever attacked me directly or indirectly (or others for that matter) for defending Dish because I like them and their product.

I like DISH products too. That is why I am disappointed with the direction that they have chosen to move in the last 5 or 6 years. They have continued to put their FEES and short term profits over their need for sub growth and long term viability. Every time they come up with something that sounds good like Blockbuster@home , there are short comings that make the service not attractive. In my personal case with them it was the time it took to get a dvd from them and the order I was receiving them. If you want more reasons why I am so "negative" in my posts on DISH , I refer you to post I responded to Lt.Disher. It gives you a very big picture view of why I feel the way I do, about DISH and it's future. And as always if you prefer not to read my posts then please hit IGNORE. I won't mind in the least.

 

[Slamminc11]

...And as always if you prefer not to read my posts then please hit IGNORE. I won't mind in the least.

Back at ya! :

 

[Slamminc11]

I never said you. I was responding to the post. Now if you want to assume you are part of it, well then thats your option

Lets just say your past posts made the jump pretty easy to make! Even posts on the DTV side that you ended up having to take down...
Are you denying that in absolutely no way that post directed in my way what so ever?

 

[Mr Tony]

Are you denying that in absolutely no way that post directed in my way what so ever?

sounds like someone took too many sensitive pills this morning

You posted that "It wouldn't matter if Dish had it completely for free including the programming, some people here would still be griping and complaining about it. " (actually you specifically called out someone and then scrambled back and edited it)
to which I replied
"meanwhile Dish could raise its fees even higher and some people would go "oh well" and Dish does no wrong"

Which is the truth
There are some people who despise Dish and everything they stand for. If Dish went Belly up tomorrow they would say "hallelujah!"
Same with Directv
There are people who absolutely love Dish and no matter what they do in that persons eyes Dish can do no wrong. Raise a fee $10? Oh thats OK. Drop programming? oh well Charlie is sticking up for us.
Same with Directv

Then there are the folks who just jump between provider every 2 years for the best deal

 

[rdinkel]

Being able to finally have HD on all six of our TVs will be great. Just need to find a way not to pay monthly fees for guest bedroom TVs while not in use for months on end.

 

[rglore]

Being able to finally have HD on all six of our TVs will be great. Just need to find a way not to pay monthly fees for guest bedroom TVs while not in use for months on end.

Just buy those Joeys, only $99 each and call to activate and deactivate.

 

[navychop]

If I shifted over to a H/J from my two ViP722s, my bill would go down a dollar a month. I'd lose a tuner (not sure I'd miss it) and some redundancy (presumably) but gain some nice features, such as the single DVR/EHD pool. It's something I'll consider after it's been out a while, and a couple expected features are added. But I'm not peeved at what has been presented. Take it or leave it.

As to the "Fees Fees Endless Fees" I invite to you closely examine your local cableco. Of course an extra box should incur a cost- it certainly does at my local cableco. Too high? Well, you can control that by hooking up fewer TVs. Want every kid to have his/her own TV & independent viewing? Well, you have to pay for that. It's a nicety, not a necessity. I'm not going to go into a local store and complain that I think they should lower prices because "I know" they can sell it for less.

If I ever shifted to H/J I might add a third TV. Or go with a second Hopper. Or both.

Dish is not evil. It's just doing business as best it knows. And it knows pretty well, judging from their financial statements. The goal is profits, not subscribers. And like it or not, the odds are pretty good that Hopper/Joey is going to increase both. IMHO.

 

[Slamminc11]

sounds like someone took too many sensitive pills this morning

You posted that "It wouldn't matter if Dish had it completely for free including the programming, some people here would still be griping and complaining about it. " (actually you specifically called out someone and then scrambled back and edited it)
to which I replied
"meanwhile Dish could raise its fees even higher and some people would go "oh well" and Dish does no wrong"

Which is the truth
There are some people who despise Dish and everything they stand for. If Dish went Belly up tomorrow they would say "hallelujah!"
Same with Directv
There are people who absolutely love Dish and no matter what they do in that persons eyes Dish can do no wrong. Raise a fee $10? Oh thats OK. Drop programming? oh well Charlie is sticking up for us.
Same with Directv

Then there are the folks who just jump between provider every 2 years for the best deal

I did specifically call out someone. I called out MikeD-C05 and Claude since it seems like every one of their posts have been negitive towards dish and anything Dish does. MikeD-C05 had a problem with it so I went and deleted his name and even stated so in my following post since he felt attacked. I didn't have to do it, but since he felt so strongly about it, I went ahead and took his name off (an hour later mind you). If you want to call that "then scrambled back and edited it" then so be it.
Now, as to the "truth" part. For one of the very few times around here, I agree with you. There are some people who fall on both ends of the all bad/all good spectrum and neither would be correct IMO. But me being sensitive...not at all, just made an observation and asked a question.

 

[rdinkel]

Just buy those Joeys, only $99 each and call to activate and deactivate.

That is my plan, but I need Dish to say I can do that with owned Joeys.

 

[navychop]

That is my plan, but I need Dish to say I can do that with owned Joeys.

Yep, my thought exactly. I posted that in the "Questions" thread. We'll see when it gets answered.

 

[david_jr]

I too am a bit disappointed that the first Joey is not included free. I have been with Dish since 97 and have mostly been satisfied. I have been using a 722 & 612 to service 3 HDTV's but have 2 more HDTVs in the house with only OTA. Was hoping to get HD on all sets with the new H/J system and now realizing that is going to cost big time, going from $16 in fees for 2 HD & 1 SD output to $38 in fees for 5 HD outputs, not to mention the initial outlay upgrade fees. Will have to consider if it is worth the money and may have to reduce programming pacakages to bring it in line. Whatever I do, like others have mentioned, I am not willing to be the guinea pig. Let the new customers who are getting the freebies be the beta testers. I do not like all the fees, but I understand that they are in line with cablecos and DISH has to get a return on what has to be a pretty expensive equipment/installer cost outlay to either upgrade current or woo new customers. Lots of thinking to do on this one.

 

[n0qcu]

Just buy those Joeys, only $99 each and call to activate and deactivate.

That is my plan, but I need Dish to say I can do that with owned Joeys.

That has always been the policy with owned equipment, you can activate/deactivate at any time.

 

[TheKrell]

If Hopper/Joey is a success, a year from now, will any of these folks that are saying it's a failure rethink their comments? Will they admit they were wrong? It's always safest to avoid absolute declarations, so if you're incorrect, you don't look so bad.

Well that's true. For the record, I don't think Dish is about to go out of business in the near term.

I am furthermore pessimistic that they will change their fee-happy ways, as long as they can report a profit with about the same number of customers they have had for years. (In fact there is a direct correlation between fee-jacking and Dish profits, given their shrinking customer base.) Apparently 14M of us are enough for Dish, and they don't much care to grow at all as long as they can squeeze us for more.

I also believe that the H/J system will be adequate to maintain this customer base, or even grow it a little. I would be surprised if it gets abandoned like the 922. So in this rather modest sense, it will be a "success". But it's not going to be the runaway best-seller that allows Dish to catch up to DirecTV. I think the others in my camp all saw very strong sub growth as a real possibility with the H/J system, but know it will never happen as long as the fees are as high as they are.

My prognostication long term: Sub growth due to H/J to about 15M. No way in hell it will grow to DirecTV which is... Ah... What is that number? Over 20M I should think.

 

[theoak]

Just buy those Joeys, only $99 each and call to activate and deactivate.

I kind of like this idea. $100 ... need to think about that more ...



I think Dish needs to drop the $4 per month Whole Home (WH) fee.

I would be more game if Dish treated WH like they do EHDs.

Pay a one time fee of $40 to activate your Hopper to support Joey's. From there you can purchase your Joey out and out ... or lease your Joey for $7 per month.

With the one time $40 WH fee ... folks with just one Hopper would not have to pay the useless $4 per month charge ... when they don't even have a Joey.

Just some ideas ... if Dish is watching ...

 

[MikeD-C05]

Well that's true. For the record, I don't think Dish is about to go out of business in the near term.

I am furthermore pessimistic that they will change their fee-happy ways, as long as they can report a profit with about the same number of customers they have had for years. (In fact there is a direct correlation between fee-jacking and Dish profits, given their shrinking customer base.) Apparently 14M of us are enough for Dish, and they don't much care to grow at all as long as they can squeeze us for more.

I also believe that the H/J system will be adequate to maintain this customer base, or even grow it a little. I would be surprised if it gets abandoned like the 922. So in this rather modest sense, it will be a "success". But it's not going to be the runaway best-seller that allows Dish to catch up to DirecTV. I think the others in my camp all saw very strong sub growth as a real possibility with the H/J system, but know it will never happen as long as the fees are as high as they are.

My prognostication long term: Sub growth due to H/J to about 15M. No way in hell it will grow to DirecTV which is... Ah... What is that number? Over 20M I should think.

I will be surprised if DISH ever gets past 14 million subs. They keep shooting themselves in the foot at the wrong times.

Back in 2010 during the Great Recession, they hiked Additional receiver fees to the highest on record for either sat provider. The response was churn and more churn. They have continued to lose and gain the same millions or so subs for the last 4 - 5 years based on their FEE structure. Back when they had Dvr FEE PER DVR receiver , you could escape the additional dvr fees by subbing to AEP and you got a $5.00 discount too over traditional adding of movie packs. That was quickly done away with because they could not earn enough FEE profits for those accounts.

They first started adding subs like crazy back when they debuted the 501 /508 /721 pvrs with NO DVR Fee back in 2000 or 01. Then they added DVR fee per DVR receiver or $5.98 per dvr receiver. This caused many people to lose the extra dvrs . Then they added a tv 2 connection fee for $5.00 ,that you could avoid if you plugged in the phone. When too many people did escape the fee ,they decided to change the additional receiver fees in February of 2010. They rolled the tv 2 connection fee for $5.00, the extra receiver fee of $7.00 and the dvr fee of $5.98 into one gigantic additional receiver fee of $17.00 per any extra dual tuner dvrs on your account. This caused many to drop the second and third dual tuner dvrs on their account. I had three dual tuner dvrs back then and traded them back in for one 722k and two 211ks .

DISH now comes up with the hopper /joey system that will make your account go up by $4.00 just for the new whole house dvr fee ,whether you have any other joey on your account. So it would cost you anywhere from $24.00 - $31.00 for a couple of joeys or three joeys ,BEFORE programming. Once again they come out with this new system, right before gas is supposed to be $4.05 by April and $5.00 by summer. Next year gets no better for timing because DISH will have a basic programming price hike ,most likely $4.00 or higher like Directv did. Next year the tax cuts we have had for the last 10 years end on January 1st. So with the pay roll tax cut ending & the Bush tax cuts ending , most peoples take home money will be going down . Here is DISH wanting to hike the basic fees for their new system at the same time as programming price hikes and tax cuts ending . Perfect synergy where all bad things hit at the same time. Guess what will be cut first in most house holds? Cable/satellite tv.

Timing is everything.: