DISH lost over 318,000 subs first quarter of 2017

[MikeD-C05]

I haven't seen any other providers that don't do exactly what Dish does with fees so I'm not sure how they can be the "King" of fees. As for charging for the DVR, extra packages and receivers how exactly are they suppose to make money when their expenses go up? The only ways are to charge for their services by charging fees and raising programming prices or they have to reduce their expenses greatly.

What expenses can they drop in order to save them enough money yet continue to offer customers top of the line equipment and programming? Here are some options for lowering expenses. They can get rid of retailers, pay technicians less, stop investing in creating new technology and drop channels that keep raising their rates. Do any of these sound like smart business choices?

If they are not charging fees for all the extra things they offer they would then have to raise the price of their core programming. That would be the worst thing they could do. If customers are going to want separate programming on multiple TVs in HD and have DVR ability then they are going to have to be willing to pay a premium. This isn't free programming OTA, this is a premium service and needs to be paid for. If people want basic service then it's available to them.

Scherrman you and I have had this discussion before and we obviously disagree with each other. I will never think that more fees and increasing them like the hopper free from $7.00 in 2012 to $15.00 in 2016 is a good thing. It discourages most existing subs from even upgrading to the higher hopper and the joeys because of it. Many that do go with them as a new sub ,gets the price reduced on programming and their dvr fee dropped down to $10.00 , while the new sub commitment lasts. Even their new sub promotion discussed at Team Summit , is advertising the joeys at $5.00 each . So DISH must see that their fees are hurting them and have to reduce the price in order to attract new subs. Once the promotion is over and the commitment ends, the new sub becomes a former one in short order. AS I keep stating they lost 318,000 satellite subs in the first quarter ALONE. Something has to change if they are to survive long term. Because what they have been doing is costing them subs and at this rate they will drop under 13 million this year.

 

[dare2be]

I will never think that more fees and increasing them like the hopper free from $7.00 in 2012 to $15.00 in 2016 is a good thing.

I think Dish did themselves a disservice by introducing the Hopper with such a low introductory $7 fee, presumably to draw users from the 722, which was the workhorse of the lineup at the time. If they had started with a $10 fee similar to the 922 which had a similar interface, then maybe the sticker shock would have been less, going from $10 to $12 and then $12 to $15.

I also don't see the current $5 Joey promotion having much impact in sub growth. Even if fees were reduced permanently, the market is declining across the board and the only way to keep customers now is through bundling, which Dish currently has a disadvantage compared to the merger monopolies.

The writing is on the wall. I myself will completely cut the cord if the Flex Pack goes away or my grandfathered status disappears.

 

[Scherrman]

What is the price point that you all think would turn things around? I think it would have to be pretty darn cheap because I get the feeling that the generation of people who don't have pay TV service right now just don't want to pay a provider like Dish or a cable company at all. They seem to prefer just paying for the specific programs they want to watch at that moment. Sports are really the only thing that needs to be live for most.

 

[comfortably_numb]

What is the price point that you all think would turn things around? I think it would have to be pretty darn cheap because I get the feeling that the generation of people who don't have pay TV service right now just don't want to pay a provider like Dish or a cable company at all. They seem to prefer just paying for the specific programs they want to watch at that moment. Sports are really the only thing that needs to be live for most.

I think the Flex Pack is right there in terms of ideal pricing. It's right in line with the price points of Sling, DTVNOW, Ps Vue.

 

[Scherrman]

I think the Flex Pack is right there in terms of ideal pricing. It's right in line with the price points of Sling, DTVNOW, Ps Vue.

And then tack on the extra receiver and DVR fees.

 

[Ronnie-]

What is the price point that you all think would turn things around? I think it would have to be pretty darn cheap because I get the feeling that the generation of people who don't have pay TV service right now just don't want to pay a provider like Dish or a cable company at all. They seem to prefer just paying for the specific programs they want to watch at that moment. Sports are really the only thing that needs to be live for most.

It would have to be in line with the streaming services (all fees included) to make me look at it again, and even then I would be a hard sell.

 

[Yespage]

With Dish Anywhere app on the Amazon Fire, is there a reason to have multiple receivers (assuming someone has the Hopper 3)? Can you just stream across your own network? Or is that only good for DVR and On Demand?

 

[MikeD-C05]

And then tack on the extra receiver and DVR fees.

And that's where the problem starts. Take the Flex pack and add $36.00 worth ofdvr and additional receiver fees and it is too expensive. I suggested before and I will say again:let subs buy their joyes and then no monthly fee or tv outlet fee should be charged. I can see paying $15.00 for the hopper 3 if they must charge it, but I can't see paying an additional receiver fee at $7.00 a pop . The joeys don't work without the Hopper, so you are being charged just to see your hopper in another room.

 

[comfortably_numb]

And that's where the problem starts. Take the Flex pack and add $36.00 worth ofdvr and additional receiver fees and it is too expensive. I suggested before and I will say again:let subs buy their joyes and then no monthly fee or tv outlet fee should be charged. I can see paying $15.00 for the hopper 3 if they must charge it, but I can't see paying an additional receiver fee at $7.00 a pop . The joeys don't work without the Hopper, so you are being charged just to see your hopper in another room.

I have 2 Wally's with EHD's and only pay $7 in fees. I think Flex is still competitive especially if Dish is the "provider of last resort" in places where broadband isn't available

 

[John Lee]

It seems people 40 and younger are just fine without any pay TV service like Dish, DriecTV and cable. The majority of my friends have dropped service and rely on getting their programming through their internet. I feel I'm the last of a dying breed since I don't want to give up my Hopper.

I'm approaching 40 and mainly watch the news on Dish, but my friends are leaving Dish for other providers. Dish doesn't offer One America News, a direct competitor to Fox News. I watch One America News online with a Roku box, but it seems that news is a demo that would help Dish with sub loss. DirecTV carries One America across every package. Old guys don't cut the cord as much as the younger demo. And, yes, I love my Hopper.

 

[Scherrman]

I'm approaching 40 and mainly watch the news on Dish, but my friends are leaving Dish for other providers. Dish doesn't offer One America News, a direct competitor to Fox News. I watch One America News online with a Roku box, but it seems that news is a demo that would help Dish with sub loss. DirecTV carries One America across every package. Old guys don't cut the cord as much as the younger demo. And, yes, I love my Hopper.

I've actually been surprised at the amount of people over 40 that are beginning to cut the cord. There are a decent amount of the older generation that have adapted well to technology and have gotten tired of the dramatic increase in pay TV service.

 

[Mochuf]

I've actually been surprised at the amount of people over 40 that are beginning to cut the cord. There are a decent amount of the older generation that have adapted well to technology and have gotten tired of the dramatic increase in pay TV service.

I'm 60 and I would cut the cord in a minute if my wife gave me the ok. The only thing that gives her pause is not being able to receive the Hallmark Channel. She even told me that if Hallmark ever released a streaming service like WWE or HBO, we would be gone. Of course we've only had pay tv for a little over 10 years now. So for most of the time we've been married (28 years now), we and the kids watched ota and recorded media. My kids rarely watch anything that is not streamed over the internet and even my wife rents movies from Vudu or Amazan.

 

[comfortably_numb]

It's great having all these options and competition is good. For all the losses Dish is posting, I still believe they'll be around for a long time, even if only for rural customers and for those without broadband access.

 

[navychop]

And those of us that find it convenient.

 

[MikeD-C05]

IF DISH does nothing to address their sub losses and now profit losses , I predict the company as we know it won't exist in present form 5 years from now. Some one will either buy it up and or merge with it to change the dynamic. The old home satellite model from the 90s isn't working for the younger people and the older generations that do pay for tv , are literally dying out as we speak. So continued sub losses will keep happening each quarter from now on. Look for DISH to drop under 13 million this year, if last year is any indication of losses to be expected.

 

[rvvaquero]

IF DISH does nothing to address their sub losses and now profit losses , I predict the company as we know it won't exist in present form 5 years from now. Some one will either buy it up and or merge with it to change the dynamic. The old home satellite model from the 90s isn't working for the younger people and the older generations that do pay for tv , are literally dying out as we speak. So continued sub losses will keep happening each quarter from now on. Look for DISH to drop under 13 million this year, if last year is any indication of losses to be expected.

Okay, you've repeated this position about 100 times. So what? It doesn't take a genius to see that the technology is changing. Black and white TV's don't sell so good anymore either. I predicted that the first time I saw a color TV. Lot's of stables and buggy manufacturers went under in the transition to motorized vehicles also. That's progress.

There's little DISH can do to prevent the direction of future television delivery technology. If they choose to not change their technology to adapt to that change, they will eventually disappear as a force in the industry. And, this forum will dry up and we'll all start evaluating and criticizing some other company.

Your suggestion that DISH stop charging fees or somehow integrate those fees into a package is not going to prevent their demise anymore than selling a combination horse and buggy package would have helped those folks back when. They still have expenses associated with delivery of a service, and they still have to charge money to cover the cost of those expenses. I don't know what plan Mr. Ergen has for the future viability of his company is, but I dare say it's a bit more insightful than anything you can come up with. Or, maybe he's just going to ride this horse to the barn and make as much money as he can along the way.

 

[comfortably_numb]

Okay, you've repeated this position about 100 times. So what? It doesn't take a genius to see that the technology is changing. Black and white TV's don't sell so good anymore either. I predicted that the first time I saw a color TV. Lot's of stables and buggy manufacturers went under in the transition to motorized vehicles also. That's progress.

There's little DISH can do to prevent the direction of future television delivery technology. If they choose to not change their technology to adapt to that change, they will eventually disappear as a force in the industry. And, this forum will dry up and we'll all start evaluating and criticizing some other company.

Your suggestion that DISH stop charging fees or somehow integrate those fees into a package is not going to prevent their demise anymore than selling a combination horse and buggy package would have helped those folks back when. They still have expenses associated with delivery of a service, and they still have to charge money to cover the cost of those expenses. I don't know what plan Mr. Ergen has for the future viability of his company is, but I dare say it's a bit more insightful than anything you can come up with. Or, maybe he's just going to ride this horse to the barn and make as much money as he can along the way.

Riding the horse into the barn and then euthenizing it sounds like a Charlie thing to do

 

[dare2be]

Not sure what Dish can do to reverse the tide. The market created this mess and now the only way to hide the bleeding (it can't be stopped, unless content owners come to their senses) is to bundle services and subsidize the TV losses with other revenue (internet, phone).

 

[Scherrman]

IF DISH does nothing to address their sub losses and now profit losses , I predict the company as we know it won't exist in present form 5 years from now. Some one will either buy it up and or merge with it to change the dynamic. The old home satellite model from the 90s isn't working for the younger people and the older generations that do pay for tv , are literally dying out as we speak. So continued sub losses will keep happening each quarter from now on. Look for DISH to drop under 13 million this year, if last year is any indication of losses to be expected.

How long have people been saying the current satellite model would not last? I feel like that's been said for quite a few years now. While every other pay TV provider has changed ownership multiple times, DirecTV especially, Dish has continued on with the same owner from the very beginning. I find that extremely impressive. I don't know what's going to happen in the next 5 years but it wouldn't surprise me if Charlie and Dish are still chugging along.

 

[osu1991]

I have no doubt they'll still be around, just with several million fewer subscribers.