DirecTV Defends Its Play for Extra Innings

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Actually I deny the Dish portion of your statement. If Dish fought for the common man, they would not have channels -- any channels -- go dark, ever. CourtTV would not have gone black earlier this year. When you fight for the common man, you stand up and fight: you don't resort to litigation or mediation. You don't have pissing contests with Viacom.

The common man occasionally watches his RSN. Not talking out-of-market, I'm talking his local RSN. But Dish subscribers can't do that everywhere. How many NY Dish subscribers rcv YES and get to watch the vast majority of Yankees & Nets games ? Zero.

The common man likes to get his local affiliates; he doesn't fight the law of the land to provide distant nets.

Charlie argues against D* for trying to get EI exclusively. Yet he lacks a full-slate of RSN's. He argues against exclusive sports contracts, but won't carry RSN's when they're available. AND, he has exclusives on some of the (relatively) most-popular Cricket teams (in US terms, it would be the same as an exclusive on all Yankees' games, and all Red Sox' games). How hypocritical is that?

That's not fighting for the common man. That's crying poverty and having a pity-party.

"they would not have channels -- any channels -- go dark, ever. CourtTV would not have gone black earlier this year. When you fight for the common man, you stand up and fight: you don't resort to litigation or mediation. You don't have pissing contests with Viacom."...Beg to differ...Is it your assertion that E* should accept any and all price increases then gleefully pass off these to the consumer?..That's looking out for no one's interests but the producer...I find it incredible how some of you are perfectly willing to spend everyone else's money to satisfy the programming needs of a few..Court TV for example was not missed by many..Admittedly, the channel has a small but vocal following.
The situation with YES is similar..YES is an expensive channel. The producers set the price and whichever provider wishes to pay, gets the rights to broadcast the channel to their customers..Since E* believes the terms to be unfair to the Company and their subs the channel is not offered. I see nothing wrong with this..It's good business and it protects the consumer. We as consumers have choices. If one wishes to view YES programming badly enough, they may go to the many cable co's which carry the service or they may go to D*...It's that simple.The cricket match exclusive argument doesn't wash. Not eaxactly national interest in cricket here.
 
Time to propose sports broadcast laws like in the UK: they forbid exclusive contract to service providers must be viewable to viewer on any provider.
excellent idea..Dumb the uinreasonably large territories as well..As far as I am concerned, there should be NO blackouts..I am paying to watch so who am I hurting by watching the game on TV....
 
"they would not have channels -- any channels -- go dark, ever. CourtTV would not have gone black earlier this year. When you fight for the common man, you stand up and fight: you don't resort to litigation or mediation. You don't have pissing contests with Viacom."...Beg to differ...Is it your assertion that E* should accept any and all price increases then gleefully pass off these to the consumer?..That's looking out for no one's interests but the producer...I find it incredible how some of you are perfectly willing to spend everyone else's money to satisfy the programming needs of a few..Court TV for example was not missed by many..Admittedly, the channel has a small but vocal following.
The situation with YES is similar..YES is an expensive channel. The producers set the price and whichever provider wishes to pay, gets the rights to broadcast the channel to their customers..Since E* believes the terms to be unfair to the Company and their subs the channel is not offered. I see nothing wrong with this..It's good business and it protects the consumer. We as consumers have choices. If one wishes to view YES programming badly enough, they may go to the many cable co's which carry the service or they may go to D*...It's that simple.The cricket match exclusive argument doesn't wash. Not eaxactly national interest in cricket here.

Saying that DISH is figthing to keep the subscription cost flat is a cop-out. Subscribers have a choice; 95% have cable available as one of them. Sat tv is a luxury item. If a sub can't afford a $1/month increase then he's probably having trouble paying other bills too. COP OUT.

If YES costs marginally more than other RSN's, it's justified. They have more viewers than any other RSN in the nation. In turn the distributor can charge more for commercials. COP OUT. Even Scott concedes that lack of YES is a prime ingredient in Dish's lousy NY penetration. YES is a money-maker, not a cost.

Cricket is pertinent insofar as DISH has tried to position itself as the premier foreign-language programming distributor. The Indian population is well-educated, solid earners and generally good citizens here. India/Pakistan is huge to them, and therefore very important to Dish meeting its goals (and having an exclusive over its competition).

Providers don't have to accept any and all price increases, and I did not suggest it. They SHOULD, if they CARE about their viewers, make solid and sincere efforts to NEGOTIATE. Charlie NEVER negotiates. He takes a position and if the broadcaster doesn't cave, then Charlie goes directly to the press and makes it a media issue.

Once the press is involved, it's no longer a negotiation. It's a plea for sympathy. It happens every time. COP OUT.

FYI: I never suggested it was wrong for DISH not to carry YES. It's clearly their prerogative, and a strategic decision. But it's also that kind of short-sighted decision that has them overlooked when MLB seeks a strategic partner. Charlie wants to cry poverty, then cry sympathy, all the way to the bank. He wants everything, for free, then to turn a profit on it. See it for what it is, this has nothing to do with baseball fans and is entirely consistent with Cheap Charlie behavior.

If Charlie went fishing, it seems you've taken the bait.
 
Saying that DISH is figthing to keep the subscription cost flat is a cop-out. Subscribers have a choice; 95% have cable available as one of them. Sat tv is a luxury item. If a sub can't afford a $1/month increase then he's probably having trouble paying other bills too. COP OUT.

If YES costs marginally more than other RSN's, it's justified. They have more viewers than any other RSN in the nation. In turn the distributor can charge more for commercials. COP OUT. Even Scott concedes that lack of YES is a prime ingredient in Dish's lousy NY penetration. YES is a money-maker, not a cost.

Cricket is pertinent insofar as DISH has tried to position itself as the premier foreign-language programming distributor. The Indian population is well-educated, solid earners and generally good citizens here. India/Pakistan is huge to them, and therefore very important to Dish meeting its goals (and having an exclusive over its competition).

Providers don't have to accept any and all price increases, and I did not suggest it. They SHOULD, if they CARE about their viewers, make solid and sincere efforts to NEGOTIATE. Charlie NEVER negotiates. He takes a position and if the broadcaster doesn't cave, then Charlie goes directly to the press and makes it a media issue.

Once the press is involved, it's no longer a negotiation. It's a plea for sympathy. It happens every time. COP OUT.

FYI: I never suggested it was wrong for DISH not to carry YES. It's clearly their prerogative, and a strategic decision. But it's also that kind of short-sighted decision that has them overlooked when MLB seeks a strategic partner. Charlie wants to cry poverty, then cry sympathy, all the way to the bank. He wants everything, for free, then to turn a profit on it. See it for what it is, this has nothing to do with baseball fans and is entirely consistent with Cheap Charlie behavior.

If Charlie went fishing, it seems you've taken the bait.
A cop out huh?..OIk so lets have it your way..A dollar here ,a dollar there ist's ok..Incrementalism..% one dollar increases atill equals a $5 increase..Got a pice of advice for ya..If YOU want it YOU pay for it..Don't ask me to subsidize YOUR viewing desires..I don't car about whether or not YES is in your opinion "marginally more expensive"(BTW show the proof) than other RSN's. The rub here is Steinbrenner wants the channel to be a basic. The subs who are not Yankee fans are stuck paying the extra $$ for a channel they don't want..Ifyou consider that a cop out ,so be it.. Don't bring other posters into this discussion because they happen to support your argument. You obviosuly have a bias here so your argument isn't based on reason, it's fueled by emotion..You still cannot see past the fact that you believe that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few.
 
A cop out huh?..OIk so lets have it your way..A dollar here ,a dollar there ist's ok..Incrementalism..% one dollar increases atill equals a $5 increase..Got a pice of advice for ya..If YOU want it YOU pay for it..Don't ask me to subsidize YOUR viewing desires..I don't car about whether or not YES is in your opinion "marginally more expensive"(BTW show the proof) than other RSN's. The rub here is Steinbrenner wants the channel to be a basic. The subs who are not Yankee fans are stuck paying the extra $$ for a channel they don't want..Ifyou consider that a cop out ,so be it.. Don't bring other posters into this discussion because they happen to support your argument. You obviosuly have a bias here so your argument isn't based on reason, it's fueled by emotion..You still cannot see past the fact that you believe that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few.

I totally disagree with the statement"that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few".That's another reason I switched to DirecTV look at DISH's packages loaded with sports channels(ESPN is a given) but with ESPN-U and CSTV
you have to subscribe to DirecTV's Sports Pak to get them if you have Choice Xtra.I
don't care anything about sports channels or movie channels(Encore) but if I want
all the basic channels on DISH I have to subsidize the few.That's why I became a DirecTV subscriber if you want it you can subscribe to it.:rolleyes:
 
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The fact of the matter is I should get what I pay for,not what they think I should see.I paid for all the sports channels.I have tons of FSN channels,YES network, Sun Sports,but all the games get blacked out because I live in Georgia.I paid to get a game on all the time just about I can watch.Not the crappy programs that keep coming on FSN all day and then dark screen and then right back to crappy programs.I want games.So the games are on,I just cant see them.Thats not what I paid for.Directv needs to do something about it I feel because I am very close to crying.:D
 
The fact of the matter is I should get what I pay for,not what they think I should see.I paid for all the sports channels.I have tons of FSN channels,YES network, Sun Sports,but all the games get blacked out because I live in Georgia.I paid to get a game on all the time just about I can watch.Not the crappy programs that keep coming on FSN all day and then dark screen and then right back to crappy programs.I want games.So the games are on,I just cant see them.Thats not what I paid for.Directv needs to do something about it I feel because I am very close to crying.:D

Before you paid for it, you should have read the black out rules. The last thing on the page. http://directv.com/DTVAPP/packProg/channelChart2.jsp?assetId=1100069
 
A cop out huh?..OIk so lets have it your way..A dollar here ,a dollar there ist's ok..Incrementalism..% one dollar increases atill equals a $5 increase..Got a pice of advice for ya..If YOU want it YOU pay for it..Don't ask me to subsidize YOUR viewing desires..I don't car about whether or not YES is in your opinion "marginally more expensive"(BTW show the proof) than other RSN's. The rub here is Steinbrenner wants the channel to be a basic. The subs who are not Yankee fans are stuck paying the extra $$ for a channel they don't want..Ifyou consider that a cop out ,so be it.. Don't bring other posters into this discussion because they happen to support your argument. You obviosuly have a bias here so your argument isn't based on reason, it's fueled by emotion..You still cannot see past the fact that you believe that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few.

My my. There are about 150 channels in MY basic tier package I would willingly give up to reduce my cost. Why should I get stuck paying for THOSE channels. Your argument is groundless IMO. BTW, I think its really only hurting DISH - they have poor numbers in NY DMA and that's a HUGE reason why. I think my mother used to call it biting your nose to spite your face.
 
The fact of the matter is I should get what I pay for,not what they think I should see.I paid for all the sports channels.I have tons of FSN channels,YES network, Sun Sports,but all the games get blacked out because I live in Georgia.I paid to get a game on all the time just about I can watch.Not the crappy programs that keep coming on FSN all day and then dark screen and then right back to crappy programs.I want games.So the games are on,I just cant see them.Thats not what I paid for.Directv needs to do something about it I feel because I am very close to crying.:D

The blackout part is not within DirecTV control. Thank the NAB and your congressman for that.
 
A cop out huh?..OIk so lets have it your way..A dollar here ,a dollar there ist's ok..Incrementalism..% one dollar increases atill equals a $5 increase..Got a pice of advice for ya..If YOU want it YOU pay for it..Don't ask me to subsidize YOUR viewing desires..I don't car about whether or not YES is in your opinion "marginally more expensive"(BTW show the proof) than other RSN's. The rub here is Steinbrenner wants the channel to be a basic. The subs who are not Yankee fans are stuck paying the extra $$ for a channel they don't want..Ifyou consider that a cop out ,so be it.. Don't bring other posters into this discussion because they happen to support your argument. You obviosuly have a bias here so your argument isn't based on reason, it's fueled by emotion..You still cannot see past the fact that you believe that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few.

Sounds like your blood pressure spiked a notch. Calm down so you don't have a stroke, will ya?

Fact of the matter is, my argument is based entirely on reason. YES is nothing more than an example (you ever heard of an example?). In this case, YES is the perfect example. DISH is getting cut-out of MLB EI because they have excluded the largest, most lucrative market in the nation: NYC and its surrounding area.

How could they convince anybody that they're a serious sports player when they are totally willing to exclude that market?

I mentioned Scott because he often touts the Dish horn, and in this case is confused by the lack of Dish action re: YES. It's 100% relevant.

If you really want to talk about BIAS.... just look at your username. Do you really think that you aren't ADVERTISING your BIAS every time you post.... Mr DISHCOMM?????

come on, get serious. you accusing anybody of bias is hilarious. I didn't realize I subscribed to Comedy Central.
 
excellent idea..Dumb the uinreasonably large territories as well..As far as I am concerned, there should be NO blackouts..I am paying to watch so who am I hurting by watching the game on TV....

Actually I would be interested in pay-per-view games. I'd be willing to pay $1.99 for each games I choose to watch, or maybe $99 for a 1-team season pass.

Unfortunately the NAB has a lot of money and they have each and every member of congress in their collective pocket.
 
The fact of the matter is I should get what I pay for,not what they think I should see.I paid for all the sports channels.I have tons of FSN channels,YES network, Sun Sports,but all the games get blacked out because I live in Georgia.I paid to get a game on all the time just about I can watch.Not the crappy programs that keep coming on FSN all day and then dark screen and then right back to crappy programs.I want games.So the games are on,I just cant see them.Thats not what I paid for.Directv needs to do something about it I feel because I am very close to crying.:D

Good thing you put the grin at the end.

I can't believe the number of people that are clueless about what the sports pack actually is. Do they really think anybody would pay $200-$300 for a Extra Innings/League Pass/Center Ice/etc. if they could just subscribe to the sports pack for ten bucks a month?
 
If D* gets the package , fine Ill just sub to their very basic programming so I can get the EI package. If Dish keeps it GREAT! I don't want to move unless I want to. I don't mind paying a few bucks a month so I can have my baseball. If I do have to get D* I'll hold off until the end of the year to see if I want to permanently switch from Dish to Direct. So far all I have heard from Direct is a bucket full of promises and nothing else. I like my Dish and it's programming and would prefer to stay, but if Direct comes through with all of the new HD programming I won't have a problem switching. I am very patient and won't jump the gun for a bunch of maybes. I just wished someone would make a decision so I can go forward.
 
I totally disagree with the statement"that all subs should subsidize the viewing choices of a few".That's another reason I switched to DirecTV look at DISH's packages loaded with sports channels(ESPN is a given) but with ESPN-U and CSTV
you have to subscribe to DirecTV's Sports Pak to get them if you have Choice Xtra.I
don't care anything about sports channels or movie channels(Encore) but if I want
all the basic channels on DISH I have to subsidize the few.That's why I became a DirecTV subscriber if you want it you can subscribe to it.:rolleyes:
ESPN is in 90 million homes..You are in a very small minority of people who DON'T care for ESPN..That's your choice..Fact is we all subsidize programming that we don't care for..A perfect example of why I advocate a la carte.
BTW most sports and movie channels are premuims..So you decided to take the plunge and invoke ESPN..Your choice. Your argument will fall on deaf ears. To comapre niche channels like Court Tv to powerhouses like ESPN is like throwing little leaguers up to bat vs Roger Clemmens....
 
ESPN is in 90 million homes..You are in a very small minority of people who DON'T care for ESPN..That's your choice..Fact is we all subsidize programming that we don't care for..A perfect example of why I advocate a la carte.
BTW most sports and movie channels are premuims..So you decided to take the plunge and invoke ESPN..Your choice. Your argument will fall on deaf ears. To comapre niche channels like Court Tv to powerhouses like ESPN is like throwing little leaguers up to bat vs Roger Clemmens....

Your point is off again. ESPN was not in 90 million homes overnight. They also had to get carriage agreements when they launched, and don't think it was anywhere near automatic. I can remember early years of ESPN when major sports was very rare, and the days and nights were filled with repeat after repeat of ''strongest man' competitions. ESPN was every bit a niche channel when it originated also. BTW, Roger Clemmens WAS a little leaguer ALSO when he was a kid - and thats the point also, he needed that experience to develop his talent also.
 
Sounds like your blood pressure spiked a notch. Calm down so you don't have a stroke, will ya?

Fact of the matter is, my argument is based entirely on reason. YES is nothing more than an example (you ever heard of an example?). In this case, YES is the perfect example. DISH is getting cut-out of MLB EI because they have excluded the largest, most lucrative market in the nation: NYC and its surrounding area.

How could they convince anybody that they're a serious sports player when they are totally willing to exclude that market?

I mentioned Scott because he often touts the Dish horn, and in this case is confused by the lack of Dish action re: YES. It's 100% relevant.

If you really want to talk about BIAS.... just look at your username. Do you really think that you aren't ADVERTISING your BIAS every time you post.... Mr DISHCOMM?????

come on, get serious. you accusing anybody of bias is hilarious. I didn't realize I subscribed to Comedy Central.
You posted THAT?!! An I blew a gasket?...Puhlllleeeeze....Look pal , ya goit called out and ya didn't like it..SO be it.
How you can make the leap from the E*/YES issue to E* "getting cut out of EI" is a mysytery. The two issues are mutually exclusive..In the future if you want to use examples/analogies please make assurances that one has someothing to do with the other.."
"If you really want to talk about BIAS.... just look at your username. Do you really think that you aren't ADVERTISING your BIAS every time you post"....
This is very amusing....So what is it you have against promoting one's business?...
I've got your number ,pal..You are up against it on this one and you'll throw anything out there to save yourself...Sort of like throwing your gun at your enemy because you've run out of bullets...We're done here..Discussion over...
 
You posted THAT?!! An I blew a gasket?...Puhlllleeeeze....Look pal , ya goit called out and ya didn't like it..SO be it.
How you can make the leap from the E*/YES issue to E* "getting cut out of EI" is a mysytery. The two issues are mutually exclusive..In the future if you want to use examples/analogies please make assurances that one has someothing to do with the other.."
"If you really want to talk about BIAS.... just look at your username. Do you really think that you aren't ADVERTISING your BIAS every time you post"....
This is very amusing....So what is it you have against promoting one's business?...
I've got your number ,pal..You are up against it on this one and you'll throw anything out there to save yourself...Sort of like throwing your gun at your enemy because you've run out of bullets...We're done here..Discussion over...


I'm not gonna get in the middle of you two - but your argument DISHCOMM is off-base in so many ways.

For you to naively think there is NO connection between the E*/YES issue and the EI issue is wrong - and one of the reasons that MLB might want to offer D* an exclusive. DISH is cutting the most watched MLB channel out from the LARGEST DMA in the country - that affects everything - ad rates, viewership, buy rates - you name it. EVERY owner gets a piece of the action, and the action is reduced greatly when the largest RSN, the most watched team is NOT included in your offering.

Hate the Yanks, love the Yanks - don't matter - they are BY FAR the largest draw!
 
This is very amusing....So what is it you have against promoting one's business?...

You are free to promote your business, and I have no issue with it at all. But you demonstrate a financially-motivated bias, a much heavier bias than my subscriber-level one. Don't point at my clothes unless you want me to point out that you're standing naked in the middle of the street.

FWIW, my decision to go D* rather than E* was primarily based on how E* handles negotiations, the potential to suddenly have channels go dark, and the lack of a strong slate of sports programming. Re: my sat provider, money is not the primary issue. I've got no sympathy for Charlie cuz he pissed in his own bed and now it's coming-around.
 
Seems to me that Dish has a lot of the sports channels these days. Now I remember when they did not have teh NFL Network or some of the other sports channels but correct me if I am wrong. Dish is carrying them all with the exception of the YES Network ans MASN in the Washington D.C. True Charlie can be a tight wad but he does not have the DirecTV pay any price mentality that DirecTV Does.

I noticed we at Dish Network got SNY and Sports Time Ohio pretty quickly after they launched.

With my DirecTV subscription I paid $12.99 if I remember correctly for the RSN that cost $5.99 a month with Dish Network, Not counting YES and MASN which was a black channel at the time. I did watch some of YES when I had it but it was blacked out so much that I dropped the Sports Pack from my DirectV subscription.
 
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