combining OTA and FTA onto one cable

[ZetaMale]

I've been trying to find a splitter and combiner that would allow me to combine OTA and FTA LNBF freqs onto one cable and so far I haven't found a splitter and combiner that can do this. Is it possible? I want to reduce the number of cables running thru the house. Of course, there needs to be a DC pass for the FTA port. I have a couple of splitters/combiners with DC pass but they don't work below 950 MHz.

 

[mr3p]

Would these work?

Diplexer

 

[KE4EST]

Mr3p hit the nail. A diplexer is what you need. You will need two; one for each end.
I highly recommend against it, unless there is just no way to run a second coax, without destroying your house.
90% of the time a second coax can be run, in places you might not think it can happen, easier than you think.
You will introduce loss times 2.
Now having said all that in most cases you will be ok with diplexers.
You will notice it though on signals that are at the threshold(OTA and FTA); those you have a high chance of losing.

 

[ZetaMale]

Would these work?

Diplexer

That looks like those will work. I guess I'm terrible at web searches.

 

[harshness]

You will introduce loss times 2.

As an example, the Holland STVC imparts about 1dB of loss on both bands at both ends of the cable.

You will notice it though on signals that are at the threshold(OTA and FTA); those you have a high chance of losing.

There are no OTA TV signals anywhere near the threshold. The SAT side curve flattens out by the time you get to 950MHz (the bottom end of FTA IF).

Note that if cable television or cable broadband (DOCSIS 2 or higher) are in play, diplexers are not a dependable option as modern cable may put TV and broadband channels above 1GHz.

 

[KE4EST]

There are no OTA TV signals anywhere near the threshold.

They are at my house.

 

[ZetaMale]

Mr3p hit the nail. A diplexer is what you need. You will need two; one for each end.
I highly recommend against it, unless there is just no way to run a second coax, without destroying your house.
90% of the time a second coax can be run, in places you might not think it can happen, easier than you think.
You will introduce loss times 2.
Now having said all that in most cases you will be ok with diplexers.
You will notice it though on signals that are at the threshold(OTA and FTA); those you have a high chance of losing.

Running the cables isn't a problem for me but I prefer not to enclose them in some kind of "raceway" and running inside walls isn't a good choice. It's my wife that has a problem with the cables being visible. So, the fewer cables the better.

 

[ZetaMale]

As an example, the Holland STVC imparts about 1dB of loss on both bands at both ends of the cable.
There are no OTA TV signals anywhere near the threshold. The SAT side curve flattens out by the time you get to 950MHz (the bottom end of FTA IF).

Note that if cable television or cable broadband (DOCSIS 2 or higher) are in play, diplexers are not a dependable option as modern cable may put TV and broadband channels above 1GHz.

I don't plan on subbing to cable TV again. As for OTA, some DTV channels are about 35-40 miles away so I use an outdoor antenna.

 

[KE4EST]

Nah, I don't like the looks of visible conduit in a house. Even the stuff that is "pretty".
Prefer in the wall or in crawl space and up through floor, behind TV.

 

[ZetaMale]

Nah, I don't like the looks of visible conduit in a house. Even the stuff that is "pretty".
Prefer in the wall or in crawl space and up through floor, behind TV.

My wife would "ahem" me if I cut a hole in the new wood floor. I guess I need to get creative.

 

[FaT Air]

Another option is an NTSC modulator at the remotely located FTA box.
Control it via 'remote extenders' I'm using 2, one on the Amiko HDSE, and another on the DVR. Can watch either on any television. Drawbacks: Not HD or stereo.
Add the modulators signal into the antenna before splitters, with a splitter in reverse. (distribution amps may be necessary)

 

[jorgek]

I'm sharing about 50 feet of RG6 for OTA and FTA. The diplexors (not be confused with splitters) are bandpass filters and introduce very little loss.
Only 1 issue is that if the OTA and FTA boxes are ON at the same time, then there is a slight signal drop on the OTA side. I have tried 2 different brands of diplexor with the same result.
Its not a problem since I don't watch both at the same time and a distro amp on the OTA side compensates nicely.

 

[harshness]

I'm sharing about 50 feet of RG6 for OTA and FTA. The diplexors (not be confused with splitters) are bandpass filters and introduce very little loss.

For some, 2dB is not "very little" relative to the signal that they're getting.

 

[jorgek]

Agreed but you can compensate for the losses with pre-amps or distro-amps.
This may not be the solution for everyone, it does work for me. Diplexors are getting a bad rap because they are beening confused with splitters.

 

[harshness]

Diplexors are getting a bad rap because they are beening confused with splitters.

As there isn't any reasonable substitute for a pair of diplexers (aside from employing a second cable), do you suppose it matters whether diplexers get a bad rap or not?

Versus the herein recommended alternative of running a second cable, diplexers are the alternative that run the highest risk of creating problems; especially if an OTA pre-amp turns out to be necessary.

 

[jorgek]

Every installation is different. Its not always possible to run additional cabling. My preference is to run separate cables as well. My experience so far with diplexors has been for the most part positive.
I believe many OTA users already run a pre-amp or amp especially if feeding more than 1 TV. I'm feeding 3 TV's with about 75 feet of RG6. The distro amp compensates very well for the added splitters (2) and cables losses.

There was a time that I would not have used a diplexor either because of negative comments regarding them especially by many who have not even used them.

 

[harshness]

I believe many OTA users already run a pre-amp or amp especially if feeding more than 1 TV.

The misstep in your argument is that you typically cannot use a diplexer pair and a pre-amp in combination as the diplexer pair only passes DC the SAT side so there's no easy way to power the pre-amp.

Amplifying the signal after the loss has taken its toll isn't as effective as boosting before the loss.

 

[ZetaMale]

I'm not concerned about 1 or 2 dB loss. If the signal is that weak I'd be out there tweaking on things virtually every week (maybe daily) or I'd be cursing my setup on a regular basis. I guess when everything gets streamed over the internet then maybe we'll be happy? Probably not.

 

[ray224000]

I have an OTA and FTA set up. I use two cables, one from each, coming into the house. At the junction box in the house I combined the signals (using the attached image) to existing cable which goes to one of my bed rooms. I found a way to replicate this so I have it setup to go to two different locations in the house.

This is what I use to combine the signals.

I can't get too technical and explain how this works. I just know it does.

 

[harshness]

I guess when everything gets streamed over the internet then maybe we'll be happy? Probably not.

The problem with the Internet is that it is so easy to make things so you have to at least register (if not pay) to use them.