Coax question

[FTA4PA]

I'm looking to install some new c/ku dishes and (possibly) upgrade the old wiring I have for the two dishes I have now. Old ones are (and new ones will be) 140-150 feet from the house. The current coax I am using is from a Directv install about 6 years ago. I am planning on trenching with my tiller and running the coax and actuator wires through 2" pvc. I found this product (https://www.perfect-10.tv/WebStore/ProductDetail.aspx?ID=5835) and would like to know if anyone has experience with it. Good? Bad? Better than what I have now? I did notice that the conductor is copper clad, not solid copper. How much does this matter? Is there any other coax you would recommend instead of this that won't break the bank? Thanks for your input!

 

[FaT Air]

You'll hear many argue that you should use solid copper with quad shield cables.
Quad sheilding: IMHO, it's not necessary unless you have to make your runs alongside other cables used for other purposes that could potentially introduce noise into your cables. Shielding protects your signal from interference more than 'holding' your signal in the cable.
I have been using single shield for years without problems or dual shield if found in the closeout bin cheaper than the single shield cable. Usually Comm-Scope brand. ( specs are very similar, IIRR )
Solid or copper clad?
RF flows on the surface of the conductor. (Skin effect) so having a steel core really is a non issue for your RF signal. The higher the frequency the thinner this 'skin' becomes.
It becomes an issue if you're also using it to power something that takes a large amount of power as DC current flows throughout the conductor.
4 amps in a 20 ga solid copper coax is probably going to work at 100 ft. Not so if clad.
Got to perform ohms law with it's ohms/ft and your power demands.
All in all, if it's in the budget, and fits the need, I'd use it.

 

[jorgek]

As long as the coax cable is rated for sat use that is upto 3.5 GHZ you'r ok as per Fat Air's recommendations. As a side your LNBF down converts the 11-12 GHZ sat signals to a range of 950-1450 MHZ for FTA. So 3.5 rated coax is more that enough for FTA use.

If you do decide on quad cable you may have to also get connectors that will fit properly since quad is somewhat thicker.

 

[Titanium]

Personally, I wouldn't put in a day of trenching and the cost of pvc conduit then cheap out on the reason I was spending the time and money in the first place! I only install quad shield solid copper core.

Better shielding helps those weak DiSEqC and 22KHz signals return to control the switches and motors.

Copper clad will provide lower power for the LNBs and motors. It is also more susceptible to corrosion.

Single coax runs will be easier to pull and add additional runs or replace. Dual coax cables tend to be much more stiff and harder to pull. Leave a pull line in the conduit for future pulls.

An easy way to pull the cables is to glue the pvc joints and attach a shop vacuum to one end. Tie the pull line to a small poly bag and inset into the other end. The shop vacuum will draw the pull string through a hundred feet of conduit in a few seconds!

 

[FTA4PA]

Thanks for the input so far. I'm digesting it all and have a question. I will be using an Amiko D-8/1 diseqc switch with five lnbs connected. Do all the lnbs receive power at the same time (even though only one is selected for viewing) or does only the selected one receive power?

 

[FaT Air]

only the one selected wiii be powered.
If there were 5 LNBF's powered at once you'd be at, or above, the current capabilities of most FTA receivers.

 

[FTA4PA]

only the one selected wiii be powered.
If there were 5 LNBF's powered at once you'd be at, or above, the current capabilities of most FTA receivers.

Thanks, kinda thought so but wasn't sure.

 

[harshness]

I only install quad shield solid copper core.

Quad shield is a waste if it is going to be buried. It is also harder to work with because of its somewhat larger minimum bend radius.

 

[FaT Air]

Unless is following power, household or greater, electrical switching, or a mass of data wires. All IMHO

 

[Titanium]

No coax should have a bend less than a 6-8" radius, so the difference between the cable types in a 2" conduit is moot. There will be no noticeable difference pulling these two cables through a 2" with corner sweeps. The only coax that types that one would need to worry about not making it through a 2" conduit sweep is a hardline and fighting several tight RG11s.

All in all, I would probably choose a quality UG cable type with heavy poly jacket over anything that we have discussed so-far in this thread. I know most hobbyist hate the UG cable and instead go the easy and cheapest route and place regular coax in PVC. I am swayed by my background having done thousands of installs and service calls (often to fix cheap shortcuts). Have had to replace way too many underground drops to count due to water intrusion, nicks and splices to mess around with cheap and incorrect selection and installation of cables and connectors.

When it comes to enjoying the hobby, do whatever floats your boat and keeps your coax dry, cozy and passing signals!

 

[wallyhts]

If you got money to spend call out the big boys to Directional drill 3 or 4 foot deep and have them pull a couple of hdpe pieces. I don't have the cash or I would do (2) 4" from satellite garden to house.

I'm in love with these drills lol

 

[harshness]

Unless is following power, household or greater, electrical switching, or a mass of data wires. All IMHO

Few of these technologies are going to impact (or themselves be impacted by) a satellite IF signal. DC and current loop are non-issues.

Of course if you've decided that your hot tub, RV, boathouse and windmill are all going to be run through the same conduit, you might be a redneck.

 

[FTA4PA]

I want to thank everyone for their suggestions and advice. Especially like Titanium's idea of pulling the cable through the conduit with a poly bag and vac! I'm always pleased with the great response from Satellite Guys members. Although the cable I currently have is working there are a couple reasons I want to replace it. The installers who did the job did not seem to know what they were doing and arrived totally unprepared. They were told in advance that we did not want a roof install, that trees would be blocking any ground install near the house and that the dish would need to be quite a distance from the house. When they arrived there were no markings on the van. They did not have the correct pole to put the dish on and bought one from me that I had in my shed. They also had to borrow my pick (they had forgotten theirs). They needed to run four lines to the house. After searching their van they said they wouldn't have enough cable but finally came up with some. Later, when I started our FTA setup, I could not even find markings on one of coax cables. They buried the coax barely below the ground in some spots and I had to bury those parts deeper myself. Our ground is very rocky but there were no rocks in the yard after they left so I can only assume they went back into the trench and were tamped down along with the cable. Shortly after the install was done we started having problems and someone else (luckily) had to come out to realign the dish. Considering the quality of their work and the unknown quality of some of the cable, both before and after installation, I feel it's best to replace all of it. I found this coax (https://www.perfect-10.tv/WebStore/ProductDetail.aspx?ID=4727). Single instead of dual, solid copper conductor for better power, still standard shielding but the old stuff is standard and there hasn't been a problem with interference so not too worried about that. I can get 1000' delivered by the beginning of September for $86 shipped. Our limited budget won't let me go for anything like RG11 but if anyone has another RG6 option that is better than this for near that price please post it otherwise I'll probably order this.

 

[FaT Air]

Few of these technologies are going to impact (or themselves be impacted by) a satellite IF signal. DC and current loop are non-issues.

They will not be impacted by your signal from the coax. But noise on these lines could easily impact your satellite IF signal. That's the reason there is dual and quad shielded coax available.

 

[harshness]

That's the reason there is dual and quad shielded coax available.

The reason for quad shield isn't burial applications. It is typically above-ground applications in the presence of significant RF interference; something that typically isn't present in serial data transmission or DC power cabling.

 

[FTA4PA]

I went ahead and ordered the coax mentioned above this morning. Delivery should be the beginning of September. I will start another thread (with pics) once I make some progress on my additions. Thanks again to everyone for your input!