Cablevision Enters into Interim Agreement Regarding VOOM
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See The Big Picture
Minutia. This is why we're here bickering and fretting about whether this service will survive or not and Charles Dolan is a visionary millionaire.
People are buying HDTVs in ever increasing numbers. At some point a switch will be flipped and they will demand HD content. One of these companies or a company yet to be conceived will be there to meet that demand. It's only a matter of time. Mr C. Dolan wants it to be him and VOOM in whatever form the company evolves into. He's looking further down the road then most of this country's business moguls who are more interested in shareholder's short term profits. Apparently his vision is not hereditary.
If everyone had the outlooks of all the negative nellies here we would still be mucking stalls and buying hay and oats instead of gasoline.
Quit raining on the VOOM parade. If you can't say something positive than why say it at all?
Minutia. This is why we're here bickering and fretting about whether this service will survive or not and Charles Dolan is a visionary millionaire.
People are buying HDTVs in ever increasing numbers. At some point a switch will be flipped and they will demand HD content. One of these companies or a company yet to be conceived will be there to meet that demand. It's only a matter of time. Mr C. Dolan wants it to be him and VOOM in whatever form the company evolves into. He's looking further down the road then most of this country's business moguls who are more interested in shareholder's short term profits. Apparently his vision is not hereditary.
If everyone had the outlooks of all the negative nellies here we would still be mucking stalls and buying hay and oats instead of gasoline.
Quit raining on the VOOM parade. If you can't say something positive than why say it at all?
Wooooohhhhhaaaaa Vvvvvvvoooooooommmmmm
I think voom is great. They are the only reason I went out and bought a HDTV and there service kicks a**. So stop the whining and just enjoy the service and hope that all goes well with the acquisition so we can continue to enjoy kick a** HD for a long time to come.
:clap 
I think voom is great. They are the only reason I went out and bought a HDTV and there service kicks a**. So stop the whining and just enjoy the service and hope that all goes well with the acquisition so we can continue to enjoy kick a** HD for a long time to come.
:clap Here we go...
Yeah, let's all beat up on someone who isn't crazy enough to believe Voom will survive...
Voom had too many subs!!?? When? If 30,000 (or so) subs is too many how do they intend on servicing the amount they'll need to become profitable (it will be a LOT more than that!)??? Just because some dealers told you this doesn't mean anything. As we've all found out around here, the dealers know even less than the CSRs (as a whole).
And exactly WHAT sources should Voom tap into which will give them the magic number of subs they need to become profitable? I'm all ears. If this were the case, why is it nobody is stepping up to the plate to invest in Voom??? Are you investing in Voom (other than as as sub)?? If it's such a great investment then everyone here should call them up and tell them you're willing to pony up what you can out of your savings. Any takers??? I didn't think so... If YOU wouldn't invest in it, why would someone else who knows more about the business (and business in general) than ALL of us put together???
I'm not saying Voom is going down by the end of the month. Heck, I don't know for sure of ANYTHING. What I'm saying is, NOBODY here knows what's happening. Everytime something is mentioned everyone freaks out and says, "See! Voom is gonna make it!" Nothing ANYWHERE has said such a thing. Basically, (and I'll do this again in case you missed it before), we know very little. Here's what we know:
1. CVC wants to shut down/disband/stop spending money on Voom (however you wanna word it).
2. Echostar is in an agreement to purchase Voom's satellite and some other equipment.
3. This purchase is being reviewed by everyone who needs to review it. NOBODY knows the outcome of this review.
4. Dolan is trying to keep Voom alive by getting funding from somewhere (whether it's his money or someone else's).
5. Voom is still broadcasting to subs as of 3/9/2005.
Other than that, we really don't know much else. Everything else is pure speculation (on my part, too).
The other thing is, that was WAAAAAYYY before all of the problems with companies hiding loses and all that fun stuff with Enron and other companies. People weren't as apt to sue you for losing a bunch of THEIR money (being a public company). So DTV had a LOT more leeway than they might get today. It was also before the .com problems so people weren't as leary about losing some money up front as they are today. So don't try and compare Voom to what DTV did. It's night and day other than their both in the satellite business.
The Rickster
Yeah, let's all beat up on someone who isn't crazy enough to believe Voom will survive...
I am no longer a sub. I was a sub for over a year. I got tired of the problems I was experiencing. Tired of the useless customer service. Tired of the promises of, "We're working on it..." Not trying to convince anyone to cancel, it's just why I did. So I do know a few things about Voom.
Hold on a second.... Alright, I'm better now. Had to pick myself up off the floor from laughing so hard.
Voom had too many subs!!?? When? If 30,000 (or so) subs is too many how do they intend on servicing the amount they'll need to become profitable (it will be a LOT more than that!)??? Just because some dealers told you this doesn't mean anything. As we've all found out around here, the dealers know even less than the CSRs (as a whole).
And exactly WHAT sources should Voom tap into which will give them the magic number of subs they need to become profitable? I'm all ears. If this were the case, why is it nobody is stepping up to the plate to invest in Voom??? Are you investing in Voom (other than as as sub)?? If it's such a great investment then everyone here should call them up and tell them you're willing to pony up what you can out of your savings. Any takers??? I didn't think so... If YOU wouldn't invest in it, why would someone else who knows more about the business (and business in general) than ALL of us put together???
I'm not saying Voom is going down by the end of the month. Heck, I don't know for sure of ANYTHING. What I'm saying is, NOBODY here knows what's happening. Everytime something is mentioned everyone freaks out and says, "See! Voom is gonna make it!" Nothing ANYWHERE has said such a thing. Basically, (and I'll do this again in case you missed it before), we know very little. Here's what we know:
1. CVC wants to shut down/disband/stop spending money on Voom (however you wanna word it).
2. Echostar is in an agreement to purchase Voom's satellite and some other equipment.
3. This purchase is being reviewed by everyone who needs to review it. NOBODY knows the outcome of this review.
4. Dolan is trying to keep Voom alive by getting funding from somewhere (whether it's his money or someone else's).
5. Voom is still broadcasting to subs as of 3/9/2005.
Other than that, we really don't know much else. Everything else is pure speculation (on my part, too).
Give ME a break! Everyone wants to compare Voom to other products/services which lost a lot of money at the start. Voom is trying to play in an already mature market. They have a LOT of competition. DTV had (basically) NO competition...just cable. It is HARDLY identical to what's happening right now with Voom. First of all, I believe DTV had a million subs after their first year of operation (or their second if not). Voom is NOWHERE near that kind of number with subs. They're not even looking like they're gonna be there any time soon! So, although DTV lost a lot of money at the start, they were building the business. More importantly, the business WAS growing. Voom is HARDLY growing.
The other thing is, that was WAAAAAYYY before all of the problems with companies hiding loses and all that fun stuff with Enron and other companies. People weren't as apt to sue you for losing a bunch of THEIR money (being a public company). So DTV had a LOT more leeway than they might get today. It was also before the .com problems so people weren't as leary about losing some money up front as they are today. So don't try and compare Voom to what DTV did. It's night and day other than their both in the satellite business.
The Rickster
GadgetRick,
Show some respect or shut your mouth if you can't. I don't know it all but I sure know a lot more than you on this subject since I work in this environment every day. If you read my post you would see I sell VOOM equipment to dealers. So I do know more than you because I do this for a living. And yes laugh your ass off but the facts are the facts, VOOM couldn't install everyone that signed up in a timely manner which cost them, they didn't install people properly and lost customers, they didn't have qualiity customer service so they lost customers, they weren't even close on how to market and lost customers, and on and on and on about how they lost or never got their base. BrandSmart in SFL had over a 500 person waiting list and that's just one retailer in SFL.
There are dealers around the country who install thousands and thousands of D* and E* customers each month. Dealers that could easily and have shown interest in taking on VOOM and would do great with it. Strong independent dealers do more business than you can fathom so don't sarcastically ask me, "WHAT sources should Voom tap into which will give them the magic number of subs they need to become profitable?" That's just one, so before you get in someone's face have your crap straight or shut up.
Show some respect or shut your mouth if you can't. I don't know it all but I sure know a lot more than you on this subject since I work in this environment every day. If you read my post you would see I sell VOOM equipment to dealers. So I do know more than you because I do this for a living. And yes laugh your ass off but the facts are the facts, VOOM couldn't install everyone that signed up in a timely manner which cost them, they didn't install people properly and lost customers, they didn't have qualiity customer service so they lost customers, they weren't even close on how to market and lost customers, and on and on and on about how they lost or never got their base. BrandSmart in SFL had over a 500 person waiting list and that's just one retailer in SFL.
There are dealers around the country who install thousands and thousands of D* and E* customers each month. Dealers that could easily and have shown interest in taking on VOOM and would do great with it. Strong independent dealers do more business than you can fathom so don't sarcastically ask me, "WHAT sources should Voom tap into which will give them the magic number of subs they need to become profitable?" That's just one, so before you get in someone's face have your crap straight or shut up.
Good Job: but you Forgot, AMC6 and all other equipment still held by Voom, only sold 61.5 and the uplink center to that Bird, that's how I've read it all, but they still have AMC6 all the rest of equipment, I belive this is correct don't you? OH I'm sorry I forgot about the New birds being built, and the future slot's for them, maybe E had a real deal, you know the future slot's for the new birds being subcontracted to VOOM , who picks up those orbit slots, if voom is not there???Sean Mota said:Agreed... (now let's go back and watch our respective providers
DTV by the Numbers
· DTV displays will reach 5.5 million units in 2004.
· Widescreen aspect ratios will hit 80 percent of DTV sales.
· Average DTV price will drop to $1,406 in 2004
With the first phase of a DTV tuner mandate approaching in July 2004, some TV manufacturers expanded their lines of fully integrated DTV sets in 2003 and 2004 models. Still, the penetration of DTVs capable of receiving digital broadcasts in U.S. households is small in comparison to DTV monitors.
Digital Set-top Box Sales:
According to CEA Market Research, digital set-top tuners, required for DTV monitors to receive over-the-air terrestrial DTV, are forecast to sell 498,000 units by the end of 2004. The industry sold 241,000 set-top tuners in 2003.
DTV on Growth Curve:
Consumers invested more than $10 billion in DTVs from the last quarter of 1998 through January 2004. In five years, nearly 8.87 million DTV products were sold, according to CEA statistics. The $16 billion invested by consumers in digital television by early 2004 will grow to more than $24 billion by yearend, according to CEA market forecasts. In 2004, CEA projects sales of 5.7 million units.
The bulk of DTV sales are high-definition television sets and monitors. Digital television equipment sales beat CEA’s target 3.8 million for DTV products in 2003, finishing the year with 4 million unit sales to dealers. Because of this, CEA has increased sales expectations slightly for the next three years, with 5.8 million DTV units expected in 2004, 8.3 million in 2005, 11.9 million in 2006 and 16.2 million in 2007. Earlier, CEA anticipated 5.4 million in 2004, 8 million in 2005 and 10.5 million in 2006.
CEA says 81 percent of DTV displays sold in 2003 were capable of displaying a picture in HDTV resolution, while the remaining 19 percent were enhanced definition televisions (EDTV). Due to expanded DTV assortments, the percentage of HDTV sales slipped from 85 percent. Another contributing factor to the decline are expanded offerings of plasma and LCD TV flat-panel displays with more affordable enhanced definition TV resolution.
Since the DTV launch the average price has fallen almost 50 percent. More consumers now see the value in their DTV purchases. The category’s average selling price has rapidly decreased since the launch. In 1998 the average DTV price was $3,147, while in 2003 the average selling price dropped to $1,557. This year, CEA expects average DTV prices to dip to $1,406.
DTVs Get Wider:
Consumers also are casting their voting dollars for DTV displays that have widescreen 16:9 aspect ratios. By the end of 2003, approximately 74 percent of all DTVs sold had wide screen sizes, up from 60 percent in 2002. That percentage is expected to rise to nearly 80 percent in 2004. The remainder has the more squarish 4:3 aspect ratio.
· DTV displays will reach 5.5 million units in 2004.
· Widescreen aspect ratios will hit 80 percent of DTV sales.
· Average DTV price will drop to $1,406 in 2004
With the first phase of a DTV tuner mandate approaching in July 2004, some TV manufacturers expanded their lines of fully integrated DTV sets in 2003 and 2004 models. Still, the penetration of DTVs capable of receiving digital broadcasts in U.S. households is small in comparison to DTV monitors.
Digital Set-top Box Sales:
According to CEA Market Research, digital set-top tuners, required for DTV monitors to receive over-the-air terrestrial DTV, are forecast to sell 498,000 units by the end of 2004. The industry sold 241,000 set-top tuners in 2003.
DTV on Growth Curve:
Consumers invested more than $10 billion in DTVs from the last quarter of 1998 through January 2004. In five years, nearly 8.87 million DTV products were sold, according to CEA statistics. The $16 billion invested by consumers in digital television by early 2004 will grow to more than $24 billion by yearend, according to CEA market forecasts. In 2004, CEA projects sales of 5.7 million units.
The bulk of DTV sales are high-definition television sets and monitors. Digital television equipment sales beat CEA’s target 3.8 million for DTV products in 2003, finishing the year with 4 million unit sales to dealers. Because of this, CEA has increased sales expectations slightly for the next three years, with 5.8 million DTV units expected in 2004, 8.3 million in 2005, 11.9 million in 2006 and 16.2 million in 2007. Earlier, CEA anticipated 5.4 million in 2004, 8 million in 2005 and 10.5 million in 2006.
CEA says 81 percent of DTV displays sold in 2003 were capable of displaying a picture in HDTV resolution, while the remaining 19 percent were enhanced definition televisions (EDTV). Due to expanded DTV assortments, the percentage of HDTV sales slipped from 85 percent. Another contributing factor to the decline are expanded offerings of plasma and LCD TV flat-panel displays with more affordable enhanced definition TV resolution.
Since the DTV launch the average price has fallen almost 50 percent. More consumers now see the value in their DTV purchases. The category’s average selling price has rapidly decreased since the launch. In 1998 the average DTV price was $3,147, while in 2003 the average selling price dropped to $1,557. This year, CEA expects average DTV prices to dip to $1,406.
DTVs Get Wider:
Consumers also are casting their voting dollars for DTV displays that have widescreen 16:9 aspect ratios. By the end of 2003, approximately 74 percent of all DTVs sold had wide screen sizes, up from 60 percent in 2002. That percentage is expected to rise to nearly 80 percent in 2004. The remainder has the more squarish 4:3 aspect ratio.
okay....
GadgetRick,
A) I would add #6....."Voom is still actively adding channels."
Now I understand that could mean contractual obligations or it could mean proof of future vision and life...
B) Your argument about this being a mature market is excellent. Now, I'm unsure if it really is mature is some aspects (HD being an obvious exception) but in terms of having established competition you REALLY make a good point.
C) Regarding tapping into sources - I don't think VOOM has any awareness with the mass market....nor have they penetrated many niches. I think there is a huge opportunity to tap into sources....but then again, maybe they have tried and failed?
D) While I think VOOM's customer service is about as friendly and efficient (online) as I have ever encountered, unfortunately, like most companies (especially in this industry) the CSR's are just not empowered with any information nor are they empowered with any decision making type of authority. This does tend to make it hard on the customer....BUT.....I have never experienced any customer service worse than with Dish Network. Not only were the reps flat out rude, but they were ignorant and the company on whole was just unwilling to be flexible about anything. Cable is weird...one day I'll talk with a friendly expert who is empowered...and the next day I talk with a Roseanne type who wouldn't know 5.1 from 51.......
E) As odd as it may sound, I think there could be some truth to the argument VOOM initially had too many subs.
Plus, I was told I had to wait three weeks to get hooked up...I mean, doesn't that seem long? They don't seem to have the resources to expand...so in a way..they may have too much interest in some areas. This is spin of course...but....
GadgetRick,
A) I would add #6....."Voom is still actively adding channels."
Now I understand that could mean contractual obligations or it could mean proof of future vision and life...
B) Your argument about this being a mature market is excellent. Now, I'm unsure if it really is mature is some aspects (HD being an obvious exception) but in terms of having established competition you REALLY make a good point.
C) Regarding tapping into sources - I don't think VOOM has any awareness with the mass market....nor have they penetrated many niches. I think there is a huge opportunity to tap into sources....but then again, maybe they have tried and failed?
D) While I think VOOM's customer service is about as friendly and efficient (online) as I have ever encountered, unfortunately, like most companies (especially in this industry) the CSR's are just not empowered with any information nor are they empowered with any decision making type of authority. This does tend to make it hard on the customer....BUT.....I have never experienced any customer service worse than with Dish Network. Not only were the reps flat out rude, but they were ignorant and the company on whole was just unwilling to be flexible about anything. Cable is weird...one day I'll talk with a friendly expert who is empowered...and the next day I talk with a Roseanne type who wouldn't know 5.1 from 51.......
E) As odd as it may sound, I think there could be some truth to the argument VOOM initially had too many subs.
Plus, I was told I had to wait three weeks to get hooked up...I mean, doesn't that seem long? They don't seem to have the resources to expand...so in a way..they may have too much interest in some areas. This is spin of course...but....
Cablevision shares rise on Voom sale
By Aline van Duyn in New York
Published: January 20 2005 23:55 | Last updated: January 21 2005 16:18
Shares in Cablevision rose sharply on Friday after the company agreed to sell its loss-making Voom subsidiary to Echostar Communications for $200m.
The agreement to sell Voom, a high-definition television service set up in 2003 by the Dolan family which controls Cablevision, ends weeks of speculation about its fate. The issue created a rift between family members, with the company’s founder, Charles Dolan, wanting to keep it.
By Aline van Duyn in New York
Published: January 20 2005 23:55 | Last updated: January 21 2005 16:18
Shares in Cablevision rose sharply on Friday after the company agreed to sell its loss-making Voom subsidiary to Echostar Communications for $200m.
The agreement to sell Voom, a high-definition television service set up in 2003 by the Dolan family which controls Cablevision, ends weeks of speculation about its fate. The issue created a rift between family members, with the company’s founder, Charles Dolan, wanting to keep it.
Industries / Media & internet Print article | Email article
Chances rise of cable sale to fund Voom
By Aline van Duyn in New York
Published: March 9 2005 18:54 | Last updated: March 9 2005 18:54
Cablevision's shares rose on Wednesday on growing expectations that the company's cable assets will be sold by its founder, Charles Dolan, to finance the loss-making Voom satellite service.
Mr Dolan, known as Chuck, last week replaced board members who had sided with his son James in opposing plans for the Voom business. James Dolan wants to shut the operation down, while Mr Dolan and another son, Thomas, the company's chief information officer, want to keep it going.
Chances rise of cable sale to fund Voom
By Aline van Duyn in New York
Published: March 9 2005 18:54 | Last updated: March 9 2005 18:54
Cablevision's shares rose on Wednesday on growing expectations that the company's cable assets will be sold by its founder, Charles Dolan, to finance the loss-making Voom satellite service.
Mr Dolan, known as Chuck, last week replaced board members who had sided with his son James in opposing plans for the Voom business. James Dolan wants to shut the operation down, while Mr Dolan and another son, Thomas, the company's chief information officer, want to keep it going.
Eventhough the 1st post was a mistake on my part...doesn't it seem strange that it is ALMOST the same post.....the soap continues......
GadgetRick said:
Or they say "see! Voom is gonna die!"
GadgetRick said:
It was stated in the press release from 02/28/05 that C. Dolan already has the financing lined up.
GadgetRick said:
Wow! HDTV is a mature market already. This is exactly why Mr Dolan is a Millionaire and you're not!
GadgetRick said:
Look at your numbers. DTV had less than 100,000 subs end of year 1.
They had 1 million when the price came down with the second manuf for boxes and the prices for boxes plummetted, sometime into year 3!
They also required installation and had install problems, holding back their growth for quite a few months. Many people complaining about 'no show' installs, equpt problems, complained as they paid full price and new eqpt was so cheap, etc, etc. I cite the DTV UUNET 'forums' from the late 80's and early 90's. I printed (on dot matrix), many pages from these groups at the time, because I was helping with a suit for people against DirectTV/RCA, that was never filed
philhu said:
That being said v* doesn't have time to grow. The only supporter they have is Dolan, unlike the shareholders that d* had at that point. v* is bleeding money and doesn't have any supporters, hell the employees were given notices they were going to be laid off in 30 days. d* had more time to grow but your thought of 'following the exact pattern' is rediculous simply because they are 2 entirely different companies. Different management, different directions, and different ideals. Best case scenario v* survives and goes on. Lets just say that for cake and giggles, it survives and continues on. They market completely seperately also. If you don't have an hd tv do you even think you would know about voom? Hell no, much cheaper options for something that could actually be used. Thats what the normal consumer is going to be interested in. d* had that advantage in that they said 'we have these stations and its less then cable.' v* can compete but not enough to save customers, thats what saves companies in this industry. v* isn't doing that and hoping hd catches on, as we see not going to happen as soon as any of us want. Personally I want to see it live as much as the next, almost got it if it weren't for the requirement about having the landline. But face the facts, its bleeding profusely and the only person that can save it is Chuck who is under enormous pressure from everyone to back down.
drod said:
say who... you... how do you know? Do you have inside information that this is so?
drod said:
So what? They are still employeed and we haven't seen anyone being laid off and it was supposed to star on 3/5/05. Right? Read the other sticky and take a hint of what happened.
drod said:
The HDTV market has yet to star .
drod said:
WTF? are you so brainwashed that you only see D* as the only alternative. Geee.... Where do you come from? The better the competation the better it is for consumers. You cannot ditacte the way consumers will go. Some consumers like cable because that's what they want. Some like satellite for other options. Some like sports more than other some like Dish Network because there is a value there. Some will like the emerging technology because there will be value. D* is not the ony kid around the corner and will never be the only alternative. Take the blind out of your eyes with that argument.
drod said:
where you are going with this? Yes, V* does not the support of customers to break even right now. But consider that they are doing something that no one in the HDTV industry is doing. They are trying to support 21 HD channels to which they are not only a DBS providers but also a content provider. That takes money to do. I applaud their efforts for just doing that.
drod said:
misinformed.
drod said:
Again how do you know?
The only reason these Trolls come to the Voom forum is because there ain't Shicrap to watch on D* or E*.
