Being Forced To Get Satellite Internet - Which of the Three Should I Go With?

[TheTechGuru]

I'm told that only the 95 is available in my area. Was I lied to?

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The Hughes website only shows Connect and Connect PRO available in my area when I put in my address.

The installer told me basically there is the Ku legacy, old Ka GEN4 on 95 and new Ka GEN4 on 107 and the new GEN4 is not available in my area yet.

Edited Using My Computer.

I know I was flat out lied to by the sales department, they told me VOIP works on GEN4, well both my MagicJack and Sprint Airave Fem2Cell are too choppy to have a conversation. Doing a RMA return on the MagicJack Plus to pay for a AT&T POTS line.

The sales department also told me that VPN's work, I neglected to specify that I meant I use a incoming PPTP VPN to connect to my home network when away which now I know will not work simply because there is no public IP address to connect to.

delivery of high-speed Internet access through the development of more advanced technology. Building on its advanced HN satellite platform, Hughes released its next-generation broadband satellite modem, the HN9000, in March 2008. New HughesNet customers may receive either the HN7000S or HN9000 satellite modem, depending on their location, the service plan selected, and the satellite assigned to provide their service.

The HN9000 is 5 years old?!?!?!?!? Man I'm really feeling ripped off.

Chatted with support, they're basically saying I can't get IPv6 because I'm not on GEN4 and I can't get a static IP because I am on a GEN4 plan. WTH? This leaves me with no option to accept incoming connections.

 

[jimdandyvi]

DynamicDNS

Have you looked at using a service such as DynamicDNS, etc. that will provide a work around for people needing a static public IP when their ISP only provides a dynamic IP?

Most routers have the option for using a service such as this. Some services charge, but there are free options.

 

[grohgreg]

I tried holding you back, but you were bound and determined to get something that you clearly didn't understand up front. Like I said, you have the option to cancel within 30 days. You should only have to pay for the serviced provided between commissioning and cancellation.

You do NOT have Gen4, the HN9000 is legacy Ka-band that uses that quirky outdoor unit. Gen4 uses the HT1000 modem and a completely different outdoor unit. When I said Gen4 and Exede were almost identical technically, I wasn't kidding. Both have two grades of service (fast and faster) depending upon your satellite coverage. Exede5 uses the SBC2 modem on their older satellite, Exede12 uses the same modem on their newer/faster satellite. Similarly, Hughes uses the HT1000 modem on the older satellite, and the same HT1000 on their newer/faster satellite. You got neither, the HN9000 is a slower legacy modem on their slower satellite. Yes, its faster than the old HN7000S or the Wildblue SBC1, but it's still slower than both Gen4 and Exede.

What you should have been told is that the slower Gen4 (HT1000 on the 95W satellite) is temporarily unavailable. This happens regularly with both Hughes and ViaSat as new accounts begin to saturate their server farms. Rather than degrade service to existing customers due to server congestion, they simply halt new sales until they expand server capacity on the ground. In the interim, they foist crap like this HN9000 on unsuspecting customers - who are then penalized if/when they try to get out of their two year commitment. My recommendation is to cancel the HN9000 account, press Hughes for a timeline for when Gen4 will be available at your address, and use some non-contractual or short-term connection in the interim.
Gen4 service may become available in days/weeks/months, but they have a bad policy of not keeping the dealers/installers informed. With a prepaid or short term local account, you may have to put up with less than satisfactory internet service in the short term. But at least you won't be locked in for the long term.

If you keep the HN9000 for the whole two years - and want outside access to your router/PC - you'll have to pony up the additional bucks for a static IP. As I stated, HughesNet is a NAT-based configuration, so you don't have a definable dynamic IP either. Plus their DNS servers are completely reliant upon their proprietary HTTP acceleration. Without acceleration, internet browsing over satellite is excruciating. Hence HughesNet (and Exede) customers are tied exclusively to specific DNS servers. DDNS will not do what you want.

//greg//

 

[TheTechGuru]

I tried holding you back, but you were bound and determined to get something that you clearly didn't understand up front. Like I said, you have the option to cancel within 30 days. You should only have to pay for the serviced provided between commissioning and cancellation.

You do NOT have Gen4, the HN9000 is legacy Ka-band that uses that quirky outdoor unit. Gen4 uses the HT1000 modem and a completely different outdoor unit. When I said Gen4 and Exede were almost identical technically, I wasn't kidding. Both have two grades of service (fast and faster) depending upon your satellite coverage. Exede5 uses the SBC2 modem on their older satellite, Exede12 uses the same modem on their newer/faster satellite. Similarly, Hughes uses the HT1000 modem on the older satellite, and the same HT1000 on their newer/faster satellite. You got neither, the HN9000 is a slower legacy modem on their slower satellite. Yes, its faster than the old HN7000S or the Wildblue SBC1, but it's still slower than both Gen4 and Exede.

What you should have been told is that the slower Gen4 (HT1000 on the 95W satellite) is temporarily unavailable. This happens regularly with both Hughes and ViaSat as new accounts begin to saturate their server farms. Rather than degrade service to existing customers due to server congestion, they simply halt new sales until they expand server capacity on the ground. In the interim, they foist crap like this HN9000 on unsuspecting customers - who are then penalized if/when they try to get out of their two year commitment. My recommendation is to cancel the HN9000 account, press Hughes for a timeline for when Gen4 will be available at your address, and use some non-contractual or short-term connection in the interim.
Gen4 service may become available in days/weeks/months, but they have a bad policy of not keeping the dealers/installers informed. With a prepaid or short term local account, you may have to put up with less than satisfactory internet service in the short term. But at least you won't be locked in for the long term.

If you keep the HN9000 for the whole two years - and want outside access to your router/PC - you'll have to pony up the additional bucks for a static IP. As I stated, HughesNet is a NAT-based configuration, so you don't have a definable dynamic IP either. Plus their DNS servers are completely reliant upon their proprietary HTTP acceleration. Without acceleration, internet browsing over satellite is excruciating. Hence HughesNet (and Exede) customers are tied exclusively to specific DNS servers. DDNS will not do what you want.

//greg//

I went through with the order simply because I was out of options, I had to get something as soon as possible or I would be dropped from my college classes. What other option is there really? A neighbors open wifi is on WildBlue and I tried that and it was unusable (due to wildblue, the wifi is strong) which is why I picked HughesNet.

Exede and real Gen4 are not available here.

I turned web acceleration off because it didn't seem to make much of a difference but now I understand why it does not make a difference, because I have my network programmed to use 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 for DNS.

If you keep the HN9000 for the whole two years - and want outside access to your router/PC - you'll have to pony up the additional bucks for a static IP.

THEY SAY I CAN NOT GET A STATIC IP because I'm on GEN4 and static IP's are not available on GEN4.

In the meantime, I have setup a reverse SSH tunnel on a port on a remote server.

 

[grohgreg]

You chose to swallow retail hype rather than consider advice from a guy that's been in this game since 1981. Pretty clear my part in this is over.

//greg//

 

[TheTechGuru]

You chose to swallow retail hype rather than consider advice from a guy that's been in this game since 1981. Pretty clear my part in this is over.

//greg//

Huh? I am having a hard time deciphering what your advice is, you suggest I get something temp until the real GEN4 is available, well other than dial up there is no other option here, especially when looking for something without a contract. Aircards would be a 2 year contract and there is only Verizon 3G and AT&T's older 4G. I don't know about Verizon's, but I looked at AT&T's and it's a 5GB cap. The non-contract http://millenicom.com unlimited is not available here. The non-contract http://www.clear.com is also not available here. There was Stelera but they have gone out of business. I have even gone so far as to check with the FCC who is on and using every tower near me, and none are residential WISP's.

I don't think you fully understand my situation here, I am a student in college that is 90% online and I was already 4 weeks behind on my classes, I had to get something or be dropped from my classes and be expected to pay back the tuition that grants covered. If you know of something better that I can get within the 30 day period please let me know. My internet budget is no more than $99/mo with taxes and fees.

Does Hughes have the same policy as DirecTV when it comes to letting people out of contract if they move somewhere with NLOS? If so, I have a way out of the contract after the 30 days.

BTW, I have not paid Hughes anything but a month of service, install was free and leasing equipment.

P.S. Isn't there supposed to be a cover on the LNB? That metal is going to probably get over 120 deg here when it's 105-107 deg out.

 

[grohgreg]

I'd personally rather finish my classwork at the local library for free, than get locked into a 2 year HN9000 contract. Or use a HotSpot Finder to do your school work in a nearby free zone (I see at least 4 in Sweetwater).

I already suggested a 3G/4G prepaid account. In fact, AT&T and Verizon both show solid 3G coverage throughout Nolan County. The TelCo serving Sweetwater is
Forum SWTWTXSW: Post!
Telco: SOUTHWESTERN BELL - TX
Address: 211 E FOURTY ST
google map the location
Serves:
915-235 915-236
Contact them about DSL or WiFi

Other providers serving your general area:
WesTex Connect
Windstream
Suddenlink
Cox HSI
AT&T Southwest

By the way, I hope that's not the location you intend to install that TV antenna. If yes, it represents an interference potential to one or both of the satellite signals. And one last thing: that HughesNet introductory offer is only good for 3 months. After that your HN9000 bill reverts to regular price, and you're stuck in a 2 year contract.

//greg//

 

[Stargazer]

AT&T and Verizon now offer data plans above 5 GB, they both offer data only plans for $110 for 20 GB which is pretty competitive with the satellite offering and you can take it anywhere and get better pings along with faster speed. They have a variety of data packages below and above the 20 GB package for $110 as well.

http://www.att.com/shop/wireless/data-plans.html#fbid=MnVd0Stun4P

http://www.verizonwireless.com/wcms/consumer/shop/share-everything.html

I think if you have any issues with them that they give you time to return it. I also think there are external antennas to increase your signal strength if you have issues with that.

 

[harshness]

Chatted with support, they're basically saying I can't get IPv6 because I'm not on GEN4 and I can't get a static IP because I am on a GEN4 plan. WTH? This leaves me with no option to accept incoming connections.

Beggers can't be choosers. You seem to be operating under the foolish assumption that what you want somehow changes the laws of physics encompassing it. Incoming connections are usually possible but the question is how you want to use them.

Other than doing things that are typically against the Subscriber Agreement (have you read it?), doing things like VPN and Remote Desktop/VNC aren't really practical (although "they" may claim or infer that they are).

Business-wise, the combination of the Subscriber Agreement, Fair Access Policy and Acceptable Use policy make Hughesnet pretty much a one-way service.

 

[harshness]

Have you looked at using a service such as DynamicDNS, etc. that will provide a work around for people needing a static public IP when their ISP only provides a dynamic IP?

Hughesnet frowns on the use of Dynamic DNS services; it says so in their policies.

 

[TheTechGuru]

I'd personally rather finish my classwork at the local library for free, than get locked into a 2 year HN9000 contract. Or use a HotSpot Finder to do your school work in a nearby free zone (I see at least 4).

I don't think they'd allow me to bring a desktop computer with a oversized screen as I do my school work on my desktop as my laptop does not have the necessary resources, not to mention the fuel costs of going to town daily would add up quickly.

I already suggested a 3G/4G prepaid account. In fact, AT&T and Verizon both show solid 3G coverage throughout your county.

AT&T and Verizon now offer data plans above 5 GB, they both offer data only plans for $110 for 20 GB which is pretty competitive with the satellite offering and you can take it anywhere and get better pings along with faster speed. They have a variety of data packages below and above the 20 GB package for $110 as well.

http://www.att.com/shop/wireless/data-plans.html#fbid=MnVd0Stun4P

http://www.verizonwireless.com/wcms/consumer/shop/share-everything.html

I think if you have any issues with them that they give you time to return it. I also think there are external antennas to increase your signal strength if you have issues with that.

Yes, well my Sprint cell phone is roaming on Verizon 3G here and there is not even one bar and the speeds are around 100kbps so that counts Verizon out. AT&T, I have not looked at their prepaid data plans, but their post paid ones as far as data is concerned the max plan I see is only 5GB. I wish AT&T did have a decent data plan available, they have their older 4G here and I am in full view of the tower which is only 1mi away.

The data plans Stargazer linked are for phones not data cards, the max data plan I'm seeing for data cards is 5gb.

Contact (your telco) them about DSL or WiFi

I have contacted them. I'm 8 miles from the switch!

Other providers serving your general area:
WesTex Connect - Don't serve my location, they also NAT you like Hughes and also a 2 year contract and $100 install.
Windstream - Closest town they serve is like 15 miles away.
Suddenlink - They only serve the city limits.
Cox HSI - That is Suddenlink, Suddenlink bought the system in the city limits from Cox many years ago.
AT&T Southwest - That is the local TELCO, I have ordered POTS from them since I can't use VOIP over sat, installing next week. No DSL due to being 8 miles from switch.

By the way, I hope that's not the location you intend to install that TV antenna. If yes, it represents an interference potential to one or both of the satellite signals. And one last thing: that HughesNet introductory offer is only good for 3 months. After that your HN9000 bill reverts to regular price, and you're stuck in a 2 year contract.
//greg//

No it's not where I plan on keeping it, I had to move it out of the installer's way, the photo shows no depth, it's actually about 8 feet away from the dish, the installer also aimed the dish with the antenna where it is right now and didn't say anything.

You never did answer my other question, does HughesNet have the same policy as DirecTV where if you move somewhere with NLOS they let you out of the contract? If yes, I have a way out.

Beggers can't be choosers. You seem to be operating under the foolish assumption that what you want somehow changes the laws of physics encompassing it. Incoming connections are usually possible but the question is how you want to use them.

Other than doing things that are typically against the Subscriber Agreement (have you read it?), doing things like VPN and Remote Desktop/VNC aren't really practical (although "they" may claim or infer that they are).

Business-wise, the combination of the Subscriber Agreement, Fair Access Policy and Acceptable Use policy make Hughesnet pretty much a one-way service.

I'm mainly needing incoming connections for VNC/RemoteDesktop, remote network management, and to view my security cameras when away.

I have come up with a solution to this. I've setup a reverse SSH tunnel with Putty to my remote server and have routed a few ports on it's IP to IP's on my local LAN.

Now I do need to find something other than Putty to do it with because I need something that can remember my login info and auto reconnect if disconnected.

 

[grohgreg]

Been contributing to HugheNet forums since 2001, and have never heard of such an option. Not to say it doesn't exist, but I've never heard it discussed even once. If you ask Hughes, they'll almost certainly tell you that - given the fact that they offer service via at least a dozen satellites - instances of NLOS are pretty much nonexistent. They may put you on another satellite, but - at a minimum - you're still bound by the 2 year contract. And depending upon the type of service, they may even start the 2 year commitment all over. There is a "snowbird" clause that permits an annual move between two addresses - like summer up north and winter down south - but that's not the type of escape clause you're lookin' for. Perhaps there's a clause that lets you turn it off for six months while away, but that still doesn't get you out of the 2 year commitment.

Whoever told you a static IP was not available, was wrong. Witness these HughesNet FAQs: http://customer.kb.hughesnet.com/Pages/1105.aspx and http://customer.kb.hughesnet.com/Pages/1189.aspx#DW6000 Static IP DHCP enabled

Hughes will not support VPN (or VoIP) on any consumer accounts - including the HN9000. It can work conditionally. But even then - be prepared for excruciatingly long response times. VoIP, same thing. Again, I refer you to a business account. Besides one or more static IPs, business accounts optionally offer both VPN and VoIP acceleration. You buy the acceleration option - THEN they'll support your VPN

//greg//

 

[TheTechGuru]

Been contributing to HugheNet forums since 2001, and have never heard of such an option. Not to say it doesn't exist, but I've never heard it discussed even once. If you ask Hughes, they'll almost certainly tell you that - given the fact that they offer service via at least a dozen satellites - instances of NLOS are pretty much nonexistent. They may put you on another satellite, but - at a minimum - you're still bound by the 2 year contract. And depending upon the type of service, they may even start the 2 year commitment all over. There is a "snowbird" clause that permits an annual move between two addresses - like summer up north and winter down south - but that's not the type of escape clause you're lookin' for. Perhaps there's a clause that lets you turn it off for six months while away, but that still doesn't get you out of the 2 year commitment.

Well, do they have some not on the clarke belt? Like to the north? If not, then it definitely would not be possible to get it at the location I have in mind (a apartment with a north facing balcony that only allows dishes on balcony's per OTARD rules).

Whoever told you a static IP was not available, was wrong. Witness these HughesNet FAQs: http://customer.kb.hughesnet.com/Pages/1105.aspx and http://customer.kb.hughesnet.com/Pages/1189.aspx#DW6000 Static IP DHCP enabled

Hughes will not support VPN (or VoIP) on any consumer accounts - including the HN9000. It can work conditionally. But even then - be prepared for excruciatingly long response times. VoIP, same thing. Again, I refer you to a business account. Besides one or more static IPs, business accounts optionally offer both VPN and VoIP acceleration. You buy the acceleration option - THEN they'll support your VPN

//greg//

I am attaching a TXT file of the chat transcript with Hughes. It starts out talking about IPv6 then goes into static IP's. Who would I talk to about getting a static? and is it possible to get the fee waived if I say something like "Sales told me this stuff would work with your service but the only way for it to work would be for you to disable NAT which requires a static IP with your configuration, so please give me the static IP I need at no charge or I will be canceling at the end of my 30 day period."

 

[Stargazer]

A while back you was able to buy your own modem (a used one) and get it activated without a contract required but you had to have a certified technician come out to install or do service work if it involved tuning in the signal.

 

[grohgreg]

There's no horse-trading with their Indian tech support, it's as simple as that. If you had a business account like I recommended, you wouldn't have to deal with outsourced tech support AND you'd already have a static IP address.

//greg//

 

[Neutron]

What part of Texas are you in?

We're considering a house out in the country way outside of town and there's a telephone and DSL provider that will still provide DSL service to us.

 

[TheTechGuru]

What part of Texas are you in?

We're considering a house out in the country way outside of town and there's a telephone and DSL provider that will still provide DSL service to us.

Trashy slummy western Texas where all the big companies (and many small ones too) treat you with complete disregard just because of where you live.

If you want a chance of DSL out of the city limits you should move to a Windstream or CenturyLink telephone service area because they are actively deploying repeaters/line extenders to extend DSL out of town. AT&T does not do this as far as I've heard, they have made it very clear they could care less about people that live out of town. It takes a month to get a basic analog POTS line.

What area are you considering? (PM me if preferred).