Antenna grounding

[SaltiDawg]

... If DN says dishes should be grounded, why the hell installers don't do it? ...

You keep saying that you understand that the dish should properly grounded and yet you continue to observe installers not doing so. I again ask what you want from this thread? You've been repeatedly told that it should be properly grounded. If you have a dish that is not properly grounded, call Dish and tell them that so that they can fix the problem. Repeatedly asking the same question here will accomplish absolutely nada.

 

[dvrexpander]

Here is another thread opened regarding this. Apparently there are various opinions. All I can tell you this: DN and DTV as part of the antenna installation training, they have a manual that describes "how to ground a . If DN says dishes should be grounded, why the hell installers don't do it? In this thread http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-network-forum/220054-dish-not-grounded.html also talks about this and about a DN subscriber's complaint regarding an ungrounded dish, and DN resolved and grounded the dish free of charge. So, who is right, DN or the installers?

Installers are not required to ground if you have no ground to get to within a certain distance of the dish to the grounding point. AGAIN>..... if you have a grounding point that is say 20ft from the dish and the nearest wire run is 15ft from the Dish to the nearest receiver it serves no defensive or protective purpose.

I also will point out, if installers were FORCED to ground each and every single install then most of them wouldn't go in, customers would get pissed cause I'll be honest with everyone here- PEOPLE DON'T GIVE A DAMN!!! THEY JUST WANT TV!!! I've been the the most God awful hell holes of a home and people just don't care... no ground PERIOD - they just want that Sat hooked up and TV on!! The SatCo's would stand to lose a pile of customers and money cause of a grounding requirement that just isn't there. I've had many of my installs as well as other techs tell me their installs were inspected by DISH INSPECTORS and many that didn't have a ground never got a failed mark!! All approved for a good install. Now, I'll point out that these either didn't have a ground available or it was way too far away from the Sat mounting location cause if it was within a few feet then yes it would have been failed cause it was RIGHT THERE!

If I were you, for a antenna - just get yourself some cheap 10gauge wire and hook it up yourself. Prob take 10mins to do it and boom... your happy. Antenna's grounded - yes, Sat systems grounded - not always needed.

 

[SaltiDawg]

Installers are not required to ground if you have no ground to get to within a certain distance of the dish to the grounding point. ...

This is not true. And of course you can not cite a source.

Your pants are on fire.

From my 722k Manual:

"Note to Satellite TV System Installer. This reminder is provided to the satellite TV system installer's attention to Article 820-40 of the National Electric Code (NEC) that provides guidelines for proper grounding and, in particular, specifies that the cable ground shall be connected to the groundingsystem of the building as close to the point of cable entry as possible."

You can see that this is not the same as your, "Rule of thumb here.. ground it if you want ..." lol

 

[dvrexpander]

This is not true. And of course you can not cite a source.

Your pants are on fire.

From my 722k Manual:

"Note to Satellite TV System Installer. This reminder is provided to the satellite TV system installer's attention to Article 820-40 of the National Electric Code (NEC) that provides guidelines for proper grounding and, in particular, specifies that the cable ground shall be connected to the groundingsystem of the building as close to the point of cable entry as possible."

You can see that this is not the same as your, "Rule of thumb here.. ground it if you want ..." lol

Are you a installer? I'm telling you how it is out in the installer world. Even in your quoted list it says "provides guidelines for proper grounding" NEC code is a provided list of again - guidelines on where and how to ground. I'm telling you as a installer, noted by other installers, known to many installers etc etc..that Dish inspections will not fail you for not grounding if you CAN NOT GROUND!!

I'm not sure what part of this is hard for you to understand that not all homes have the location viable to ground too from a Sat installation stand point.

So with that I'm done in this discussion..feel free to get the last word in.

 

[SaltiDawg]

... Even in your quoted list it says "provides guidelines for proper grounding" NEC code is a provided list of again - guidelines on where and how to ground. ... .

I never said anything about how it "really is." I stated that grounding was a requirement.

The guidelines are not optional. The guidelines provide different possible approaches. The fact that you are a terrible installer who dispenses "wisdom" on the web that is contrary to the NEC, states that Dish condones such dangerous practices, and generally doesn't understand the purpose of grounding equipments as a matter of equipment and personal safety and reliability under the cachet of being an "installer" is indeed a sad thing.

 

[redcentinela]

One last question , this goes to dvrexpander. You as installer, have a house with all the wiring OK and the ground point or rod of the house pretty close , lets say 20 feet, from the antenna you just installed, are you going to ground the antenna?

And just a comment: What is the problem of doing things right? For Installers like you here where I live, around 99% of the installations made by people like you don't have any ground at all.

I will contact the correct people and make sure things are correctly done according with the law. I'll tell the people here in PR about this , and the people will demand to install the ground to those antennas. No problem. people like you should not install anything because all you say that NEC is wrong and you are right,

Are you , people against grounding, have any engineering or electrician training? Just go and change the NEC with your wisdom and knowledge about the "No Grounding Dish Antennas" arguments . When that happens, then I will change my mind.

Another thing dvrexpander, if it takes 10 minutes for me an average guy to install a ground to my sat antenna like you said, why can't an installer like you cannot do it? It should take you 5 minutes because you are an expert about antenna installations.

 

[chainblu]

I don't know what part of the world dvrexpander is is, but here in Florida DNS inspectors WILL and DO FAIL ungrounded installs. They will also fail you for using non 2.2 Ghz cable on the signal side.
So, dvrexpander, consider yourself lucky for having slack inspectors.

 

[ChapelCharlie]

Lexington is about 380,000 people and alot of E* and D* I have been looking around and I have looked at over 200 dishes and none that I have checked are grounded including mine.

Not wanting to stir the dust but.... I install in Lexington (Fayette And Most Surrounding Counties)... I have over 100 installs this year alone and everyone was grounded. I do my darnest to mount as close to the house ground as possible.

I do service calls on installations that have gone bad and I install grounding when it is not in place if possible. NEC Code Requires that DN, DT, WB and SKYWAY be grounded.

If unsure above grounding contact the local Code Enforcement office for a Code Inspector, they will tell you.

 

[redcentinela]

Thanks for all of you who has given your opinions. To resume what I found about this grounding issue:

1- Depending of the states laws and regulations, installers follow step by step the installation of the antenna and the ground. If the state's, regulations or laws are not enforced like they are supposed to, you know what is going to happen, NO ground at All.

2- DN knows that all antennas are supposed to be grounded but if like I said on # 1 they don't give a damn if dishes are grounded or not. ( or maybe is the dealers fault, who knows) . Apparently here where I live, they don't send any Quality Control personel to verify that installation are done following the NEC rules.

3- if people don't know about it, they don't care like dvrexpander says. Apparently DN don't want the people know about it, so at the end, DN don't give a damn.

4- Well, as long as people are happy and dealers profits raise and don't want to loose subscriptions, everything is OK. The solution is to give advise to people.

Thanks.

 

[Mike_H]

Each installer I've had has grounded the antenna. One though was a bit obtuse, as he was going from a Dish 500 to a dish 100 dish. The dish 500 was grounded directly to the home ground plane which was via a 6 gauge wire attached to a coax ground block and run directly below ground and into the breaker panel that was below grade on a wall in the house.

For whatever reason he didn't like that so he cut that wire and then ran the ground to the power company meter box with a corner clamp to clamp to the box.

 

[redcentinela]

Mike, at least that sounds fair, installer did the effort to ground the antenna, but believe me, here in PR where I live, I can assure you that 99% of the dish antennas installed by dn an dtv are not grounded. That is why I opened this thread to find out if you had the same problems in Continental US.

 

[SaltiDawg]

... here in PR where I live, I can assure you that 99% of the dish antennas installed by dn an dtv are not grounded. ... .

We get it already. You've told us this 14 times.

 

[redcentinela]

yes. I think it is enough with this thread. Any admin can close it. Thanks for all of the persons who gave their opinions.

 

[maximum]

I live in Phoenix and recently upgraded to an HD receiver. The technician who installed the new antenna moved the grounding block from the pole and attached it to the house but didn't actually ground it. In fact he cut the ground wire that runs along with the coax cables so it can't be grounded anymore.
We've had problems with our service ever since so I have a tech. out today and pointed out the ungrounded block. He said it doesn't really need to be grounded and that the grounding is just for lightning protection. I said I thought it was to discharge static electricity but he said no.
I find it hard to believe that the little wire that was connected to the block was meant for lightning protection. Also, why would dish require a grounding block without requiring it to be grounded?

 

[LarzarusLong]

In relation to grounding...

Just to add to this topic - what specifically needs to be grounded ? The dish, the cable or both ?

My dish will be located about 20' from my house (in-ground pole mount), on top of a small hill. The only way to get to the dish is either up/over a 100+ year old stone wall with steps or through a 100+ year old shed. I don't know how anyone could even run a ground from the dish to my house's electrical ground (about 70' away).

Where the coax cable enters into the house, I suppose you could put a grounding block, but you would still need to run a ground wire from the back of the house, alongside the house, to where the electric service enters the house (about 50-60' away).

I think this is the #1 reason you see ungrounded installs. It's just too damn hard to do in many cases and not worth the hassle for the (realistically) small amount of protection you gain.

I know NEC code requires the grounding, but specifically what are they grounding for ? If you get a direct hit on the dish by lightning, there isn't going to be much left of the dish (or most anything in the vicinity).

 

[Ben Bassinger]

I specifically asked my installer not to ground it. He of couse said OK! If a lightning strike hits your dish, a #6 copper wire isn't going to do a darn thing. Kiss your stuff goodbye anyway. There is so much voltage going through, it will light up like a flourescent light. Grounding dishes causes more issues than I think it solves.

 

[SaltiDawg]

I specifically asked my installer not to ground it. He of couse said OK! If a lightning strike hits your dish, a #6 copper wire isn't going to do a darn thing. Kiss your stuff goodbye anyway. There is so much voltage going through, it will light up like a flourescent light. Grounding dishes causes more issues than I think it solves.

Those dumb old NEC writers.

The grounding requirement is not to protect against a direct lightning strike - but I think you really already know that.