622 Freezes

[tomeckle]

About 2 months ago in January, my 622 was making noise like it was running, I couldn't get a picture black screen on TV1, TV2 snow and nothing seemed impact the situation, power off reset or anything even left power off for 20 minutes or so. I unplugged the unit and went to sleep Next morning, on a whim I plugged the unit in and after reseting satellites and downloading the guide everything worked fine, I had scheduled a service call, so I postponed the service and after seveal postponements, eventually canceled the call.

Now March 27, the same exact thing happened with the same remedy wait 12 hours or so and plug in again and unit works.

My question is given all of the problem's people report with replacement 622 units, it seems this might be a good time to request an upgraded unit, since I use both outputs TV1 and TV2, what is the most reliable HDDVR unit to get?
Any suggestions from resident experts are much appreciated.
Tom

 

[Smith P.]

Heat ? Post your counters here.

 

[Dirtydan]

Heat ? Post your counters here.

Which counters would be relevant to his problem, and also my replacement 622 that re-boots itself on occasion?

 

[Smith P.]

You'll post - we will select and analyze.

 

[tomeckle]

While heat maybe why the unit doesn't respond to a reset/I dont believe heat is the cause of the freezing up, however here are the counters for temp average 105, low 80 high 122, I have 2 fans and a usb pad cooling the av cabinet and the counters reveal they work well. The sporadic nature of the freezing during the nightly update process suggests something in the input circuitry or the update itself maybe? Software version L449 is installed. Hope this helps someone, but my question is still what receiver works more reliably?

 

[Smith P.]

I would check the HHD for bad sectors, but it will be not easy.

 

[tomeckle]

bad sectors

Probably beyond my technical skill set...unless there is a software method that does not involve opening the unit. perhaps some utility resident in the dvr itself that can be accessed by commands from the remote?
The counters do not suggest HD issues though....

 

[Smith P.]

Serach how to run DST-1 or other HDD tests by remote.

 

[tomeckle]

tests-612

I did the HDD Smart test and HDD appears fine..I am leary of doing some of the other tests because I am not sure of what I am doing and dont want to re-initiallize the disk. I have called ATT/Dish tech support and they dont have much of a clue except to exchange the 612. Thanks for your help, but from experience intermittent problems like this are very difficult to pin down. I guess waiting for the next symptom to appear is my best alternative....

 

[OnYourOwn]

The counters will not show power supply temp, only HDD temp. It is the power supply that is overheating not the HDD. The fan control software 449 is broke. That is the common thread with all the heating issues.

So get a new unit and don't let it overheat by throwing lots of air right from the first plugin at the left back side until E* realize they need to fix the software and the internal fan starts doing its job.

 

[Smith P.]

I'm concur that power supply dissipate more energy then HDD.
Care to provide some data ?

As I mentioned in that long thread - poor air flow design ( it create internal circulation of hot air and did not build that way to suck room air ) is the killer

 

[OnYourOwn]

My first new 622 lasted for alittle over a year then started spontaneously rebooting. I did not realize it at the time but when it started rebooting was alittle after the 449 software update.

I have had 4 reman units and two technicians out since and all do the same thing and none of the techs can find anything wrong at my house. Some units are worse than others in reboot frequency.

I was able to stop the rebooting by throwing lots of air at the left side near the back. This is where the power supply is, actually the power supply board is a full depth board with multiple heat sinks from about midway back to the back. This is where the air needs to flow. If I stop this air flow about 2 to 3 hours later the reboots start and continue periodically about every couple of hours until I restart the air flow.

With some units acting like this worse than others it apears that the overheating actually causes some component damage. I have also read where the air flow only decreases the frequency of the reboots, i.e. not as often.

Hope that helps.

 

[Smith P.]

Well, that not explain it; power supply component(s) could be more sensitive to certain level of temp and the hot air most of all made by black brick - HDD; re-read that main thread about dissipation and temp of components.

 

[OnYourOwn]

You are right. It could be a single electronic component in all 5 units I had that is the issue.

Please explain further your reasoning.

 

[Smith P.]

Willing you read those posts where dissipated power of HDD calculated ?
May I ask you about your engineering education/skills ? Just for get right level of discussion.

 

[OnYourOwn]

Are the terms PHD and Heathkit familiar. I learned along time ago the framed thing on the wall really means nothing. Break the glass and use it as a dart board. Actually my expertise is in building race engines, so I know alot about heat, and got shocked once so I am familiar with electricity.

So you now know I am educated and don't care and old all at the same time. Or I could be just flaunting some terms I looked up on the Internet after all this is the Internet where anything is possible. Maybe PHD just looked better than BS in the sentence.

So lets get down to what E* is missing and see if anyone, including you and me can help before I and others have to change to cable, GOD forbid.

Blow air, lots of it, Radio Shack Cat#273241, 65 cfm, at the left side of the unit and tell me it does not help the reboots, shutdowns, loss of signals, whatever the thread is calling it.

 

[CDH]

I've had a similar problem with a 622: locking up with a black screen - though it only usually happens when in dual mode, which is rare. When it does it is definitely *very* hot on the left side and left rear of the unit. Within a couple of minutes it cools enough to be able to reboot.

I'm not sure how I'd install the case fan you list above, but I have plenty of space around the unit in all directions other than the right side (it is positioned vertically, sitting on the right side).

CDH.

 

[OnYourOwn]

You mean the 622 is sitting on its right-side? If so, I would not do that as the internal fan needs the righ-side smaller slotted area to flow air through and you probably are not getting as much forced air coling as designed, even if the fan controls were working properly.

The fan I am using is standing vertically on its side, blowing to the right about a 1/4 inch from the left-side of the case. It is forcing the air into the left-side case vent slots as much as it can without any ducting. That is where the power supply heat sinks are located. It is blowing enough air that it does not heat up the hard drive which is in the middle of the case. My hard drive avg temp is 105 and it has not rebooted once today.

Note that the fan I am using is not the only fan that can be used. If you use it, be sure and tape up the connections real good, preferably with heat tape.

When dealing with heat and the latent heat of vaporization is not involved, you have to blow mass quantities and it has to be targeted.

Nice nose.

 

[CDH]

Actually it is sitting on wood blocks on the right side so that the air vents are not blocked and there is a couple of inches of clearance below them, and there is lots of space around all other sides of the unit. Basically the only parts that have any contact (that is without free air circulation) are a few inches at the front of the right side and another couple at the back.

When the left side (facing up) gets hot the right side (facing down) doesn't even feel warm.

My theory is that at certain times of day it warms up due to sun in the living room and then when in dual mode it generates more heat. But it never seems to lock up when it is recording programming (without viewing) and never seems to lock up when just watching DVR programming - just when two tuners are being used to watch programming on both TV1 and TV2.

Forgive my ignorance but how do you power the fan? It looks like the kind one would plug into a computer motherboard.

CDH.

 

[OnYourOwn]

No one is ingnorant in this world because everyone has their area of expertise.

You will need to experiment, but I would try pulling the hot air up and out of the unit first.

I appologize for not providing wiring details. Electrical wiring is just too dangerous to provide those details here. I recommend getting an electrician friend that knows how to wire a 120V fan, if possible.