622: $99 vs. $299. I found the "Catch"

[ScooterS]

Everyone, including Dish, realizes that they screwed-up with the 921. It looked good on paper several years ago when it was designed, but never had enough horsepower to work right. I'm one of the ones who paid $1K for the box.

I'm not sure that Dish is TRYING to screw their customers. I think that they are trying to dig out of a hole that they dug for themselves with the 921. I suspect that they had other plans for more bandwith that they never got. MPEG4 matured, more HD is available, and they are scrambling to get it all on the air.

Whether it is $99 or $299, there is no way that dish is making money on this deal! Think about the cost of the new box as well as the Dish 1000 and other related stuff that they are having to install.

In my case, I will need the 622, A new Dish 1000 antenna and a couple of their very expensive switches to make the conversion. Throw in what they will pay the installer and I'd suspect that my $300 deal will cost Dish about $5- 600.

Yes, they need to get their act together. On the other hand, they need to stay fiscally sound.

Why lease receivers to customers? Because, if they didn't, customers would buy them at a low price and then quickly flip them on e-bay. To make it worse, many of the folks that would buy them in the secondary market would hack them as well.

No, I'm not happy with dish or the "deal" that I got on my 921. On the other hand I'd still like to have them in business at the end of the day!

 

[seandudley]

I'm sure that others have figured this out, but it may be lost in the many posts.

According to the CSR that I just talked to......

If you are an existing HD Customer with a 921 or 942 you can order your 622 now for $299. You MAY return ANY existing receiver and get a $25 credit on your bill.

If you do the $99 rebate deal you MUST return your 921 or 942 to get the $199 rebate.

I just scheduled my install for 3/11. I'm paying the $299 so that I can keep my 921for my DVR in the bedroom. Later, I will probably upgrade to another 622.

I'm going to send back one of my unneeded 301s for the $25 credit.

Dish confirmed that the deal comes with Dish 1000 and any needed switches, etc.

YMMV.

Enjoy!

If I understand you correctly, you are saying that a CSR told you that as long as you have a 921 or 942 you can get a 622 for $299.00 without having to send anything back. If you wait until April to get the $200.00 instant rebate, you do have to send back a 921 or 942 to get the additional $200.00 off.

I just got off the phone with a CSR and she said that in order to get the 622 for $299.00, I would have to send back my leased 942. This is how I thought it was to start with, but after reading this post, I got my hopes up that I could keep my 811 and 942 and get a 622 for $299.00, but according to Dish, this isn't the case. So, if I did understand your message correctly, how the heck did you manage to get this deal? Do I need to play CSR roulette? The CSR put me on hold while she double checked to make sure what she was telling me was acurate.

 

[Fredinva]

If you own the 942, you can grandfather the old HD Pack for $15. If you do the new lease, you are stuck with HD Bronze for $55/mo.

My bill will be $15/mo for Old HD Pack + Voom + $6 Locals + $6 access fee + $6 DVR fee. That is a whopping $32/mo for 15 HD channels + the MPEG-4 locals..

MY understanding was, if you activate an MPEG4 receiver you WILL be 'metallic', bronze, silver. gold, etc.

And, if you own a 622, why will you have to pay an access fee?

just curious,
fred

 

[RobertsD]

If I understand you correctly, you are saying that a CSR told you that as long as you have a 921 or 942 you can get a 622 for $299.00 without having to send anything back. If you wait until April to get the $200.00 instant rebate, you do have to send back a 921 or 942 to get the additional $200.00 off.

I just got off the phone with a CSR and she said that in order to get the 622 for $299.00, I would have to send back my leased 942. This is how I thought it was to start with, but after reading this post, I got my hopes up that I could keep my 811 and 942 and get a 622 for $299.00, but according to Dish, this isn't the case. So, if I did understand your message correctly, how the heck did you manage to get this deal? Do I need to play CSR roulette? The CSR put me on hold while she double checked to make sure what she was telling me was acurate.

From what others have said too, it seems that you do not have to send your 942 in for $299 deal.

 

[seandudley]

Anyone know of someone I can ask for that knows how to enter it in so I can get a 622 for $299.00 without having to send them my 942?

Thanks.

 

[mwgiii]

The difference is a leased 942 vs. an owned 942.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

MPEG4 matured
...
Whether it is $99 or $299, there is no way that dish is making money on this deal!

MPEG4 "matured???"

When did that happen?

Dish isn't even able to make it work well yet.

As to the $299 deal on the leased 622, Dish is most assuredly making money on this deal. You assume that this receiver really cost them somewhere around $600-$700 to manufacture. I wouldn't be surprised if that cost were closer to $400. And if so, if they can get people to pay $300 plus money lease fees for a box that Dish retains ownership on, for something that cost around $400, or even $500, then Dish will make out like a bandit on 622s. Especially since all of these people will now be paying 33%-50% increases on monthly HD programming.

The old 921 did cost a fortune for Dish to get it to market. About 3 years of R&D and prototypes and failed designs, along with very high support costs. The 622 should be much cheaper, even with the more advanced feature set.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

If you want a leased 622 for $299, just call Dish and order one. This is the standard, everyday deal.

 

[seandudley]

If you want a leased 622 for $299, just call Dish and order one. This is the standard, everyday deal.

I think you have to be a new sub to get that deal, don't you?

 

[RobertsD]

I think you have to be a new sub to get that deal, don't you?

No, it's for everyone.

 

[jsanders]

Whether it is $99 or $299, there is no way that dish is making money on this deal! Think about the cost of the new box as well as the Dish 1000 and other related stuff that they are having to install.

They are making a killing on this deal! First, they sold you that 942 for a profit unless you were a new customer and paid $250 to upgrade. I would also guess that the 942/622 cost around $400 to make. Then they charge you $300 to lease to a new one. $250 + $300 = $550 they made a lease person pay, and they don't even own a receiver (almost the cost of buying one outright)! They make even more through the 18 month commitment. In addition, they are making 942 owners give up their 942 to get this lease deal! They made money when they sold the box, and then they pay a mere $200 to get it back. What are they going to do with that 942 they buy back? One word - ExpressVU! They make more money by selling that machine to the Canadians as a hand-me-down!

Now, since they tied your hands with an 18 month commitment of their terms, let's see how much else they make from you. I pay $32/mo for just the HD Pack. Someone leasing can't do that, they need to pay over $60/mo for the Bronze Pack. 18 months x $30/mo difference = $540!

If you lease and don't want the SD programming, that 942 to 622 upgrade lease deal made dish $250 + $300 + $540 + whatever they make when they sell the old 942 to an ExpressVU customer! They make $1090, and they don't even own a receiver! Then they make even MORE money selling the used receiver.

As far as the Dish 1000 goes, the margin on that dish is huge! It doesn't cost what they would charge you for it. However, they have already made more than enough money off of their customer to pay for it.

 

[jsanders]

MY understanding was, if you activate an MPEG4 receiver you WILL be 'metallic', bronze, silver. gold, etc.

And, if you own a 622, why will you have to pay an access fee?

just curious,
fred

That is true if you lease the 622 Fred. If you own one, you don't need to do a metalic pack. You can do the HD Stand Alone Pack for $29.99. It is a rip off because the HD Pack only costs $20 for metalic subscribers.

However, the other cool thing about owning is that you are not obligated to abide by E*'s terms. Because of that, you are not obligated to upgrade to the HD Stand Alone Pack. If you owned a 942 and have the legacy HD Pack for $9.99 + Voom for $5.00, you can keep that as a grandfathered subscription with the 622 (provided you buy the 622 and don't lease). You will get the new MPEG-4 HD Locals though. For me, it isn't worth doubling the price of the HD pack (from $15 to $30) for programs like GamePlayHD which is worthless. So, I will keep my grandfathered subscription with the new 622.

Everyone has to pay the "access fee". For most subscribers, it is built into the subscription of "qualified programming". If you don't have "qualified programming", then the "access fee" is a separate, itemized, charge.

 

[jsanders]

The question is WHY are they still paying that much for them? Do they NOT know that they cannot be used to activate MPEG-4 HD programming?

I have wondered that one too. The 942 does have some advantages over the 622 though. The big one is that E* can't disable the OTA tuner in it if you just subscribe to locals.

The other advantage is no VOD. Having to hit the 'DVR' button twice is a HUGE minus in my book. I consider it offensive that they try to sell me a movie every time I hit the DVR button just once. Charging me $5 to watch a program which they recorded without my permission is a huge minus. Using up my hard drive space to do it is a huge minus too.

The VOD thing is almost a complete deal breaker to me!

The 942 isn't a bad machine. I wouldn't pay $500 for one today though.

 

[jsanders]

Jsanders ... Congrats. You are a WINNER!!!

$130 to upgrade an owned 942 to an owned 622 is $544 better than what Dish is offering for the same thing ($25 credit and $699 for the 622).

Again, I don't understand why Dish is sticking it so badly to their HD subs.

I think this promotion should be named the "Stick'n it to you in HD" upgrade plan.

I'm sharing what I learned from this because I want to give you and everyone else here the opportunity find a good solution. Dish wants to shaft its customers, and the scenario I mentioned is the only one I have been able to think of that at least levels the playing field with E*. If anyone else can come up with one, please share it with us! They seem to have done a good job with shoring up all of the loose ends.

 

[TBarclay]

Here's a question I haven't seen addressed. OK, if you have a 921 and want the 622 upgrade with rebate, you have to turn in your old receiver. What if you have a number of recordings on the 921 that you want to keep? I can imagine a lot of people have recorded shows they haven't seen yet or stuff they'd like to archive--except there's no practical way to archive HD recordings!!

 

[DucTape]

No way they are getting my 921, hell I finally got it to where it works more often than not.
I would have to buy a 622 for it to pay off for me since my original deal with Dish is the 15 dollar HD pack + the 180 tier with no commitment and free locals so I don't want them messing with my deal. The CSR at the time said they couldn't legally charge me for the locals and I wasn't complaining. Nope I will hold out for the buy price to come down since they must continue Mpeg2 for the grandfathered people less they cough up a real deal.:

 

[AdamGott]

Yes

At least for now that is probably a yes but it seems to me that the ultimate goal is to make the MPEG2 receivers obsolete. I have been considering keeping my 942 to use as the second receiver (for when I get another HDTV) and sending in my 625 for trade-in (actually both of them are not mine, I am leasing both). I am also worried that they will shut off the HD on the 942, making it pretty much eqivalent ot the 625 (plus a $200 fee).

 

[ScooterS]

Seandudley:
My 921 is "owned" by me. Not sure what the rules are for leased gear.

 

[RobertsD]

At least for now that is probably a yes but it seems to me that the ultimate goal is to make the MPEG2 receivers obsolete. I have been considering keeping my 942 to use as the second receiver (for when I get another HDTV) and sending in my 625 for trade-in (actually both of them are not mine, I am leasing both). I am also worried that they will shut off the HD on the 942, making it pretty much eqivalent ot the 625 (plus a $200 fee).

THe old HD pack will work until they completely move all their HD channels to MPEG4, which is likely a year or more away.

 

[Paradox-SJ]

I still dont get why someone would pay to lease a 622.

At the minimum you will be out of pocket (300.00+5x18month) $390.00 not to mention the add (required) expence of the precious metal packages.

How much do you think a used 622 will sale for? If the price retention of the 942 is an indicator then one should really rethink leaseing.

I have owned a 942 for about a year (got it first week it was released) and paid 580.00 for it...I could flip it today for $400-500.00. That is at most a 31% drop in value.

I can sale my 942...in the may/june time frame to buy a 622 when inventory goes up ( I dont need and or want one though) for (guessing here) 580-680.00 and I will be out of pocket less than 200.00. That is 200.00 that I can and will make back when I sale the 622 at some feature date.

If you can sale a CE deviece for 50% of what it cost you 2 years after you have baught it you are doing very well. I do this with my HDTV, AV reciervers IPODS etc etc. You will have the latest and greatest every 2 years or less and isnt that part of the fun of this hobby?

One of the draw back to this is you have to have the cash to spend and be willing to deal with the 'joys' of resaleing you older equipement. If you can deal with these its a no brainer... Buy>hold>flip>buy...