2D to 3D Conversion??

[TheForce]

I still have the Panny in the box.

My OPPO has only given me one area of trouble with 3D. It fails to be recognized as a 3D player twice now and I found it needs to be powered down for 5 minutes and back on to rid the popup warning that the disk needs to be played in a 3D player etc. I would imagine if this is a widespread problem OPPO will find a fix for it. At least I know what to do now. Only other minor issue is the OPPO doesn't stream well but I don't need it for that. Happy to use PS3 for that.


As for 2D to 3D conversion, I haven't really used it much. It is on my Sony PJ. I need to try it with a movie sans graphics as the last time I messed with it it was on CNN which wasn't very good to watch in 3D

 

[gadgtfreek]

Im very impressed with what I saw outta the BDT110's 2D-3D tonight. Any good action style flicks that are only released in 2D will see 2D-3D used on them

 

[TheForce]

Be sure to tell us what 2D BD Titles you are converting. I want to find one I can see that others think is the best of breed. I have the Sony 2D-3D projector conversion here as I haven't even opened the Panasonic player. Last I tried the conversion setting was on CNBC on DishNetwork and didn't like how the graphics layered with the video PIP box. No real 3D except the graphics with the video layer way in the back.

 

[gadgtfreek]

I did Dark Knight last night. In the beginning when the robbers are in a vehicle pulling up, you are sitting in the back seat next to one looking out the front window of the vehicle (two other robbers are in the front seat). I swear I was riding in the car with them. Also when they slide down the line from one roof to another, very good depth. Finally, i watched the armored car chase. In much of this, its not a true 3D effect, just added depth, it kinda reminds me of the 3D effect Samsung interpolation has, but without all the FFW'd look . During the chase scene, when Batman takes the cycle thru the mall and you are behind him, it felt right there. I'm sure some of this helps with a much bigger screen that ive ever been used too, but the depth is there.

 

[toto]

Did "Unstopable" of VUDU 1080p. Looked good. I watch 95% of movies and all sports in 3D lite.

 

[Steve Mehs]

I did Dark Knight last night. In the beginning when the robbers are in a vehicle pulling up, you are sitting in the back seat next to one looking out the front window of the vehicle (two other robbers are in the front seat). I swear I was riding in the car with them. Also when they slide down the line from one roof to another, very good depth. Finally, i watched the armored car chase. In much of this, its not a true 3D effect, just added depth, it kinda reminds me of the 3D effect Samsung interpolation has, but without all the FFW'd look . During the chase scene, when Batman takes the cycle thru the mall and you are behind him, it felt right there. I'm sure some of this helps with a much bigger screen that ive ever been used too, but the depth is there.

Cool! I'll have to check that out. I bought Dark Night last week but being a longer movie I haven't had the time to watch it yet. I'll have to try it in simulated 3D mode.

 

[TheForce]

Watched the new release of 127 hours in a 2D to 3D conversion and yes it does add some depth to the image but not enough to excite me into making the switch on every movie. In fact, I watched just the first half in conversion mode. It appears to be about as good as when we had that mono audio converted to stereo.

I thought 127 hours would be a great movie to demonstrate 3D depth because it takes place in the canyons of southern Utah. Comparing these scenes with my copy of Grand Canyon Adventure, there is just a huge difference in 3D quality.

I'm only happy to know that when the editors do the conversion using very expensive process it does work so much better than the converter I have in my projector.

 

[gadgtfreek]

I did a lot of 2D-3D on Transformers last night, after finishing up the calibration. Im gonna agree, it does add depth, but not enough for me to wear glasses for a non 3D mastered flick. I tend to see more motion blur/eye issues with 2D-3D on. And I think now some of the 3D look I was seeing is just this DLP and the way it looks. I watched the HWY scene, then the battle in the city at the end with 2D-3D on, then with it off. I preferred it off.

I'm overall impressed with the depth this DLP has on it's own, dunno if it's the size, or the tech (my first one), but I like it over my S2 plasma for sure.

 

[TheForce]

Jason- let me toss this out for people to consider- The "depth" you speak of in a 2D image is not the same as the depth we see in a 3D stereoscopic image but I believe it is just a superior 2D contrast ratio that makes the better displays "pop"

 

[gadgtfreek]

I agree. Here is what Im talking about

1) 2D depth of this DLP - very very good, and I attributed Dark Knights depth to 2D-3D, when in fact if I woulda watched the same scenes in 2D, it would have been realize that the new display is part of this. Not diminishing the panny, but it was not doing as much as I thought it was
2) The 3D conversion the player is adding some depth over what the display can do, but does not equaly a 3D master/filmed title of course. I do not see the dimension and rounding of items to add that depth, as I would in a 3D title.
3) A native 3D image, the few Ive watched is a whole new depth that Ive never seen before. It goes above and beyond anything a displays contrast ratio/frame interpolation can do where people throw "3D effect" around. To me that is impression of depth/dimension in a good 2D image, but a good 3D image actually gives you that depth.

The DLP offers nice pop on 2D, and 3D is awesome.

I was shocked by the Disney Demo disc, during scenes from Christmas Carol. Scrooges face was not close to flat like in 2D, I mean the image actually rounds around the sides of his face and arms, its pretty amazing.

 

[gadgtfreek]

I'd like to add some more input on the BDT110. I tried some more back and forth on Machete today, and it definitely changes things. How Id describe it is, the screen and menus are at 8ft away from you, and the image is at 9ft, and then there is some action in between. I cant use it for long though, the motion issues bother me. Not sure if its the player, or just the way it and the Mitsu play together. People were waving flags in a crowd, and it was a mess for my eyes.

 

[teachsac]

Has to be the Mits. JVC I see no motion problems. Definitely not a mess.

S~

 

[gadgtfreek]

Not a mess in those words I guess, fast moving things just bother my eyes, and it could be my eyes. The fast fighting scenes on Transformers were not as clear and detailed as in 2D, but slow stuff looks real good.

 

[dfergie]

From reading forums ... Avs, Av, Home Theater, Home Theater Shack etc... I think each persons eyes play a big factor in how they perceive 3D(along with their sets), many will say they saw little to no effect on movies & programs I think are wow and vice versa...

 

[gadgtfreek]

Yeah, I mean the 3D native stuff looks awesome to me, as well as the 2D-3D, but something in the conversion is bothering me in fast scenes. Fast scenes on native 3D seem to be fine.

 

[TheForce]

Jason- Thanks for making your study on this. I was about ready to test my (still in the box) Panny BD player to see if it was any better at 2D conversion. At this point I won't bother.

I think the brain is having to work harder on the converted 2D illusion. There are some calibrations to do and I didn't adjust from default so maybe that needs looking into. I had no ghosting and my dimensional assessment pretty much matches what you saw and reported.

I think the answer is that the Artificial Intelligence of the converter is just not smart enough to know where to place parts of the 2D image. So, our brains are trying real hard to fabricate a 3D look that isn't being seen. Does that make sense? Originated 3D actually displays the proper scene elements in a place that appears correct so our brains do less work. Less fatiguing.

One thing is certain, 3D is a new experience in vision and we have to not just get used to it but also learn to relax and not force the 3D.


We've had this problem before with projector images. In 2D, DLP we had the rainbows to contend with. Some people never saw them and others were really bothered by them. They were also an illusion. I could see them here on my old DLP but I had to dart my eyes perpendicular to a stripe of white against dark background and the rainbow would appear for a fraction of a second. Never darting eyes, and I'd never see them. This is why people who sat close to a large screen saw them more often because the were constantly darting their vision around the screen. People with smaller screens did not dart vision around as much.

 

[dfergie]

The FPTV I'm watching now in my bedroom (110") is the Mitsubishi HC3800, many see rainbows on it, I guess I'm lucky not seeing...

 

[gadgtfreek]

I watched a little more of Machete with it on, and what I saw was that a car slight in the distance moving was pretty clear. Images in the 3D conversion made to be closer to me, like say a person running between me and the car, was just a shiny blob/blur going in front of me. The look is hard to describe, but I do not see this same thing on normal 3D, just the conversion. It copuld just be the normal look of "fake" 3D, and my eyes cannot handle it.

3D conversion is a YMMV thing probably, because there are some many factors involved. Im just glad that I can actually sit down and enjoy 3D, I was worried about getting all of this and then the first 3D program making me sick


As far as rainbows, I can see them on the 738 Mitsu if I try (jerking eyes around), and sometimes if Im looking at my laptop and race my eyes up vertically to the screen to look at something, I may or may not see one. Not a deal breaker for me at all. Since It's my first DLP, I wanted to try and see if I could replicate the rainbows, and I can, but it's not a normal viewing issue for me.

 

[teachsac]

Jason- Thanks for making your study on this. I was about ready to test my (still in the box) Panny BD player to see if it was any better at 2D conversion. At this point I won't bother.

I think the brain is having to work harder on the converted 2D illusion. There are some calibrations to do and I didn't adjust from default so maybe that needs looking into. I had no ghosting and my dimensional assessment pretty much matches what you saw and reported.

I think the answer is that the Artificial Intelligence of the converter is just not smart enough to know where to place parts of the 2D image. So, our brains are trying real hard to fabricate a 3D look that isn't being seen. Does that make sense? Originated 3D actually displays the proper scene elements in a place that appears correct so our brains do less work. Less fatiguing.

One thing is certain, 3D is a new experience in vision and we have to not just get used to it but also learn to relax and not force the 3D.


We've had this problem before with projector images. In 2D, DLP we had the rainbows to contend with. Some people never saw them and others were really bothered by them. They were also an illusion. I could see them here on my old DLP but I had to dart my eyes perpendicular to a stripe of white against dark background and the rainbow would appear for a fraction of a second. Never darting eyes, and I'd never see them. This is why people who sat close to a large screen saw them more often because the were constantly darting their vision around the screen. People with smaller screens did not dart vision around as much.

I'd give it a shot. I am not seeing any blurring on 2D-3D images with my JVC. I've found the players better than any of the sets I've seen with 2D-3D conversion. I do agree about where the subtitles are placed. I don't think I'll use the feature much when my daughter is watching, eventhough she says it doesn't bother her.

S~

 

[TheForce]

Does the JVC PJ have a 2D to 3D mode? I didn't think it did.