Upgrading subs/Bought Rythmik FV15HP

[gadgtfreek]

So, doing what bassheads do, I am looking for more output. I'd also like less space used. I started looking at some of the sub results on data-bass.com and PSA has/had a dual 15" driver sub that had outstanding output, and was only $1499. Well..., it is out of stock. I spoke with them today and it seems a replacement is in their skunkworks and should be out in a month or so. MSRP will be around $1900, and it will have dual 18" drivers and 1700w of power. Call me interested!

Here is one prototype they experimented with, and according to them the final model is "smaller". I almost hope they will go vertical like they did the dual 15" model. Height is much better than width.

 

[gadgtfreek]

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/v3600i


Oh lawd...

Has the same foot print as one of my VTF15's but is 20" taller... Its gonna be a sub 20hz, overall output monster.

 

[teachsac]

Glad you don't live next door to me

S~

 

[gadgtfreek]

LOL.

Im seriously thinking about getting on the preorder. Thats a silly price for the output that thing will have, and I get some floor back by going to one sub. That dual 18" setup should be 6-7db more output than my dual 15's, and it'll dig lower.

 

[gadgtfreek]

1)Dual 18" drivers, 1700 watts of ICE power, large slot port. The V3600 looks much like the XV30Fse except a little larger( 20"x 24"x45" W x D x H) with the slot port on the bottom(front) of the enclosure. Large traditional (removable) grill over the entire front baffle. The amp will have our typical controls---Gain, Crossover, Time delay and Room Size. Although if you intend to put the V3600 in a "small room"...we may need to talk..wink emoticon

2)The FR is similar to the V1500. (see graph at bottom)

3)Output is almost double the XV30Fse from 15hz to 125hz. The differences range from 4.9dB to 6.7dB. Average from 16-100hz is 5.8dB more for the V3600. You can see the XV30Fse output here. http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=106

V3600 output. (CEA-2010 averaged)

16-25hz ~ 122.3
31-50hz ~ 132.3
63-100hz ~ 136.0
16-100hz ~ 131.8

4)Standard Black Satin finish. No plans for wood veneer options at this time. Traditional style grills only.

5) PRICING (including shipping).

PRE-ORDER $1799 single, $3499 duals

PRE-ORDER pricing will last until 6-15.

 

[gadgtfreek]

I opted to stick with duals, I think going to single sub regardless of projected output is not a smart move, plus that dual 18" is just too tall for my area. For my needs, a JTR Cap 1400, PB13 Ultra, Rythmik FV15HP, and VTF15MK2.

JTR Cap = My favorite because it is a beast under 25hz, and that is what I want more of as well. Problem, $2000 a pc.
PB13 - Great sub, low distortion and strong in the LFE, but, $2000. Also a little longer than I want. If I was spending $2000 a pc, Id get the JTR.
VTFMK2 - upgraded amp and driver, putting out better performance for sure, but Hsu still sticks to the ideal that midbass is more important than ultra low bass
FV15HP - $1300, still more oomph than the upgraded Hsu, and well engineered and proven. One thing I like about Rythmik is the engineering in their servo subs. The drivers are monstrous (200oz magnets), and their sub amps actually have transformers and panasonic caps.

So, I ordered one FV15HP earlier, and my friend is buying the first VTF15. Will order the second Rythmik in late June and sell my other sub.

Over at data-bass the FV15 has about 9db more output than the VTF15 at 16hz, and its 12hz number is the same as the VTF15's 16hz number. The VTF15's 12 hz number isnt high enough to pass the CEA test.

So, with dual FV15's vs dual VTF15's, I gain a lot of ooomph 20hz and below, and they have a 4-5db advantage to 80hz. Also supposed to be very musical subs.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Pic of the amp, just crazy to see a transformer on the sub

30lb aluminum cone driver with rubber surround

 

[gadgtfreek]

Rythmik will be here Thursday at the latest. I also got my certified Umik-1 in and REW, so I plan to have some fun. Friend is buying one VTF15H this weekend, and once I buy the other Rythmik Ill put the other Hsu on Craigslist.

Have emailed Rythmik tech support quite a bit discussing recommended settings for my room, and they have been very fast to reply. Always good to see from a ID company because some of them are hard to get a hold of.

 

[Ilya]

Umik-1 in and REW

Let me know how that works for you! I was thinking of getting that mic myself. But my Paradigm sub came with a calibration mic, so I used that instead.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Ughhhh, couple of hours of frustration tonight. Almost got it working and then something new crashed so I punted to HTS and AVS for advice with pictures. I read gettiner REW and Asio working could be a PITA, especially via HDMI, but we shall see. I think XT32 with dual sub eq does a great job, but I wanted REW to be able to check SPL and run responses to see how speaker changes actually affect things. Figure it will be fun (if I ever get it working...)

 

[gadgtfreek]

Pics and observations:

• I like the finish better than the Hsu
• Amp knobs with the "clicks" are a lot easier to adjust when trying to get the volume right for audyssey, and trying to hit a certain spot in general
• Prefer the matte finish to the Hsu. Hsu shows touch spots from an arm or hand, FV15HP does not
• Love that it is slightly smaller
• Think the full face cover (can't see ports) looks better, especially with dust
• The way it was packed with images on how to unpack was well thought out
• Fit in finish over all seem to be a step (slight) over that of the Hsu

Beefy power cord

 

[gadgtfreek]

Response is better since removing one Hsu and adding the Rythmik. Be curious to see what it looks like with two Rythmiks

Dual VTF's

One FV15HP and one VTFMK4

 

[gadgtfreek]

Here is some data I collected. Both sets are XT32 setup, level matching afterwards with the umik-1 and REW SPL meter, and then tested with my cm140 SPL meter and blu-ray tones.

This will be dual VTF's in max extension mode vs the single VTF and FV15HP at reference volume:

Test tone---VTF's db---Mixed Subs db

16hz---85.8---92.5
20hz---85.1---93.2
25hz---84.4---91.4
31.5hz---88.5---94.5
40hz---92.5---96.5
50hz---94.6---97.8
63hz---96.2---97.5
80hz---98---97.9
100---98.4---100.7

Other thing I see here is from 16hz to 63hz, there is much less variation with the Rythmik. I almost wonder if the power of the ryhtmik isn't picking up the slack and evening things out. Makes me wonder how two will do in here...

In bayformers 1, there is a deep bass hit near the end of the movie on the highway fight scene, right after the MRAP decepticon runs thru the middle of the bus and destroys it:

107.3db---109.2db

In the city battle at the end, when iron hide flips over the lady sitting in the street, there is another good bass drop

108.3---111.7

 

[gadgtfreek]

Here is my charting, settled on 1 ports open on the VTF and FV5HP. Gives great usable output under 20hz. I should be ordering the second FV15Hp around 6/28 so things should improve even further.

 

[teachsac]

Done

S~

 

[gadgtfreek]

Thanks man. Figured it made more sense.

 

[gadgtfreek]

If I go ahead and buy while they are on sale I get the discount plus a return customer rebate, so i talked myself into going ahead and doing it! Savings of around $300.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Shipping 2nd sub today, should have it on Wed.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Pulled all the speakers last night and ran some raw sweeps with REW seeing how speakers interacted with placement. Learned some helpful things like no matter where the center is (close to wall or out) it's FR is not great. It is def the weak spot. The raw readings on the mains tell me they love to be away from the wall, so I have to get them out as far as possible and then kinda toe in. Their FR is pretty consistent and all the dips and dives in the center is what brings them down.

I moved the subs back out side the mains and moved the mains back in. What I found is that the further the subs got apart, the better their individual FR looked. Granted those still were not great. I then turned them both on from their new spots and ran a sweep and the FR was very smooth from 10hz to 120hz. I actually think it will be much improved over the run above because the 22hz dip is gone. Considering these are mismatched subs and I just set everything on the back of them by hand with no auto eq yet, the results are very promising. The speakers, especially with the center, are going to be what they are and I won't have much influence over it.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Finished aiming the center today and toe'd in the mains. I tried covering glass and all kinds of weird stuff and none had any effect on the freq response of the center. Here is a before and after chart of the subs when they were about 8 feet apart in side the mains, and now 13 feet apart.

The 22 hz dip (lower graph is 8 feet apart and upper graph is 13 feet apart) is gone and the 100-120hz is obviously improved. Be interested to see how the two Rythmiks play together tomorrow since these results are mismatched subs. its obvious in a large and odd shaped room as mine, the more they are spread out the better they do.