SOund Advice

[vurbano]

My thanks to the blubloods complaining about this at their hide out

Sound Advice: HD DVD leaves Blu-ray in the dust
Saturday, November 10, 2007
By Don Lindich
Q:Do you have a preference between HD DVD and Blu-ray? --
RHETT ELTON,
Seattle

A: I enthusiastically recommend HD DVD because it's a better product and a better proposition for consumers. Signs are showing it is going to trounce Blu-ray, and soon. Surprised? Read on.

For those looking for a single sentence explaining why go with HD DVD: It's a better thought-out, more solid product than Blu-ray, it is half the price, and picture and sound quality are identical. At less than $200 including seven or more movies, HD DVD players are a stunning value. Why pay twice the money when Blu-ray has serious issues and the movies look and sound the same?

I smile when I see people buying HD DVD players based on bargain pricing, because they are unknowingly getting the Ferrari as well! Despite its purported superiority and much higher cost, Blu-ray is the emperor with no clothes. HD DVD has been superior since day one.
HD DVD has delivered as promised from the start, receiving critical acclaim for its spectacular picture and stunning sound. Hundreds of great movies are available, with more added every week. Check out amazon.com to see the wide, varied selection.

On the other hand, at launch Blu-ray's picture quality was horrible, generating barbs such as "needs to go to the scrap heap" and "who in their right mind would ever like this?" Though they have since closed the picture quality gap, almost all Blu-ray player models announced or existing are already obsolete. They conform to an early player profile that does not support upcoming disc features. Profiles should have been finalized before product launch! Blu-ray's record has been spotty at best, and if you say it sounds like they have been fixing it as they go along, I'd say you are right.

In the words of video industry legend Joe Kane, "Blu-ray is all about greed." Though a poor value, many retailers push Blu-ray because of the higher price and higher margin. It's easy to debunk Blu-ray's purported advantages:

• "More studios support Blu-ray, including Disney ... no 'Cars' or 'Pirates' on HD DVD." Well, HD DVD has plenty of exclusive support, too, and has never lost a studio. Conversely, Paramount and DreamWorks recently abandoned Blu-ray for HD DVD, calling it "the affordable, high quality choice." So, no 'Star Trek' or 'Shrek' for Blu-ray. The answer for either camp is to get the regular DVD if you can't get the HD version.

• "Blu-ray discs have higher capacity." Another nonissue as HD DVD has enough to do the job. Plus, expensive new equipment is needed to manufacture Blu-ray discs. Existing DVD factories need little modification to press HD DVDs, meaning lower costs from movie studio to consumer.

• "More Blu-ray players have been sold and more companies make them." Well, almost all of the "Blu-ray players" sold so far are Playstation 3 game consoles that happen to have a Blu-ray drive in them. Many, if not most of them, are used solely as game machines. HD DVD has the lead in stand-alone players. As for more manufacturers, what's the difference if there are one or 10 obsolete, expensive Blu-ray models on the market?

• "Blu-ray will win because it has sold more movies to date." Another nonissue because even combined, Blu-ray and HD DVD disc sales are an infinitesimal piece of the DVD pie, a few grains of sand in a sandbox. Blu-ray's tiny numerical lead will be obliterated soon anyway because kingmaker Wal-Mart has embraced HD DVD. In early November, Wal-Mart placed HD DVD ads on primetime TV and ran a promotion estimated to have sold well over 50,000 players in a single day. Other retailers showed increased HD DVD player sales in Wal-Mart's wake, with the events making national news.

Sound Advice: HD DVD leaves Blu-ray in the dust

 

[JoeSp]

Well, isn't this an interesting article -- full of war bait! Where will we start? Let's start at the begining shall we:


I enthusiastically recommend HD DVD because it's a better product and a better proposition for consumers. Signs are showing it is going to trounce Blu-ray, and soon. Surprised? Read on.

And what signs is he pointing too? The $98 dollar dumping of a second gen player that does not do 1080p and takes forever to start a movie? He sure can not be pointing at disc sales because HD-DVD has not won one week this year and doesn't look to.

I smile when I see people buying HD DVD players based on bargain pricing, because they are unknowingly getting the Ferrari as well!


There is no Toshiba Ferrari!!! The only Ferrari in the whole HD players on both sides is the PS3!!! No HD-DVD can load a movie - start playing that movie -- iniitalize features within the movie anywhere close to as fast as the PS3 can. If there is a HD player that can be called a Ferrari on the market right now it is the PS3 -- and this is a game machine! The XBOX360 HD-DVD drive comes in second here -- another game machine with no advanced audio features!

On the other hand, at launch Blu-ray's picture quality was horrible

As for talking about the launch quality -- you can never go back folks, that is behind us and BD has been delivering the PQ in spades!! BD has the most 5 star PQ ratings of either format and generally delivers the same or better quality in PQ now.

almost all Blu-ray player models announced or existing are already obsolete

NO BD player will become obsolete. This is fools gold folks. Anybody here remember purchasing those first DVD players that did not have DTS decoding, or later PQ controls, or later upconversiong? As more features became available did any of the old players become obsolete -- no. The plain fact here is that NO BD player will become obsolete! In fact, if your player is not capable of being upgraded to 1.1 you will still be able to view the features in a list format just like you do on regular DVDs. You just won't be able to view in a PIP -- that does not mean your player will be obsolete. It just will not offer the newer features -- but you will still have access to them. Remember the actual incoding of the BD movie will not change -- just the advanced features of a Java enabled menu and PIP. You will still be able to view the movie and access the menu -- it will just be like it is now on your BD player.

Profiles should have been finalized before product launch!

Only thing in this post I agree with. And the reason is simple, had the BDA launched a full featured product then BS posts like these would stop showing up -- period!! And there would be no format war because HD-DVD would not of had anything to show for except for low price and now they have pretty much exhausted that with the $98 sale. I see that as 90,000 customers who are not going to buy an A30 or A35.


• "More studios support Blu-ray, including Disney ... no 'Cars' or 'Pirates' on HD DVD." Well, HD DVD has plenty of exclusive support, too, and has never lost a studio. Conversely, Paramount and DreamWorks recently abandoned Blu-ray for HD DVD, calling it "the affordable, high quality choice." So, no 'Star Trek' or 'Shrek' for Blu-ray. The answer for either camp is to get the regular DVD if you can't get the HD version.

Lets look at this differantly -- No Pixar, No Disney, No Fox, No MGM, No Sony and what support does HD-DVD have. Well for $150 million that got Paramount and Dreamworks -- two hit wonders this year with Transformers and Shrek3. And lets not forget about being able to buy Season One of Star Trek for $150+ on HD-DVD -- I am sure that is going to sell 100,000 copies -- NOT!

• "Blu-ray discs have higher capacity." Another nonissue as HD DVD has enough to do the job. Plus, expensive new equipment is needed to manufacture Blu-ray discs. Existing DVD factories need little modification to press HD DVDs, meaning lower costs from movie studio to consumer.

Here is the LIE that every HD-DVD fan is spreading. They talk about disc space because the REAL LIMITATION to HD-DVD is BANDWITH! The product does not have enough and it is never going to change. Hence the reason you do not get those new advanced audio codecs like DolbyTrueHD or DTSMaster HD on a movie blockbuster like Transformers. They try to sell you on DD5.1+ as being enough because the bottom line is they KNOW the format can not deliver anything else!!! The usual response is that BD just has TOO MUCH Bandwith and that it is wasted!! When was the last time you purchased something and said "Oh wait, you gave me too much -- take half of it back!" ?

And if the cost of making a movie on HD-DVD is so low why is the cost of the movie to the consumer higher? No movie that sells on both formats is lower on HD-DVD then BD. As matter of fact the movie is either the same price or higher. Why is that if the cost to make them is so low? As a consumer I am only concerned with the price of the movie to me -- not the studios. (I address price differances between the formats players later)

"More Blu-ray players have been sold and more companies make them." Well, almost all of the "Blu-ray players" sold so far are Playstation 3 game consoles that happen to have a Blu-ray drive in them. Many, if not most of them, are used solely as game machines. HD DVD has the lead in stand-alone players. As for more manufacturers, what's the difference if there are one or 10 obsolete, expensive Blu-ray models on the market?

Here is the second BIG LIE from HD-DVD fans. When they want to point to the only place they currently have a lead - standalone sales -- and that lead has been shrinking all year -- they don't count the PS3 as a BD player -- because they know that if every PS3 owner purchased just one title a month this format war would be over in 6 months -- tops! Then when they want to show you that HD-DVD has a supperior attachment rate they include ALL of the PS3s sold! Real world numbers show that closer to 50% of PS3s are being used as BD players and that is the primary reason BD has outsold HD-DVD in discs sales this year at at 2 to 1 clip. That is not going to go down but that ratio will start growing as more PS3 owners start buying HDTV's and along with that a BD movie or two. (I already adress the 'obsolete' BS)

Blu-ray will win because it has sold more movies to date." Another nonissue because even combined, Blu-ray and HD DVD disc sales are an infinitesimal piece of the DVD pie, a few grains of sand in a sandbox. Blu-ray's tiny numerical lead will be obliterated soon anyway because kingmaker Wal-Mart has embraced HD DVD. In early November, Wal-Mart placed HD DVD ads on primetime TV and ran a promotion estimated to have sold well over 50,000 players in a single day. Other retailers showed increased HD DVD player sales in Wal-Mart's wake, with the events making national news.

This is the only real excitement that HD-DVD fans can point to -- they hope that Toshiba will push their prices on all their players to the sub $200 range and that will finally give them the run to overcome BD discs sales. But here is the falicy of that thinking, It is that the BDA will DO NOTHING? Already Sony has dropped prices on the PS3 and their players are due up next. Other manufacturers are looking at price drops and BD still has some major titles coming out for XMAS. What does HD-DVD offer you? Shrek3, a Bourne Title and of course STAR TREK in HD! They call BD's lead in discs sales which is 2 to 1 insignificant but they point to standalone sales (note here they are totally ignoring the PS3 numbers) as significant because of a one day product dumping sale on an old product? And they fail to point out that the PS3 alone is selling 3 times that many sales in the US a month - everyone a BD player - and using the 50% method and counting the other BD player sales is swamping whatever Toshiba has been doing. Maybe those cheap Chinese players will turn the tide for them. Nothing says quality like 'Made In China'! (Insider note here-- I deal with alot of products that have changed over to Chinese manufacturing. The quality Chinese manufacturing while being supervised by the retailer/manufacture has been good but as soon as that supervision stops and the Chinse take over the quality hits the floor. That has happened for every product that has moved its manufacturing to China. And it is a constant complaint from US distibutors of the product. Warranty repairs of these products have gone thru the roof in the last 3 years - some by as much as 400%! In order to keep consumers confidence and business manufacturers are extending their warranty periods to redicuslous lenghts. I have seen many friends in my industry go out of business because of this. They just can not make a living on warranty alone. And this is happening in every sector of manufacturing/retailing in our country! For those who want to know I own a tool repair business that has been in business since 1982. If you walk into a Lowe's or Home Depot and purchase a power tool, compressor, nailgun, air tool, paint spayer, generator, pressure washer, tile saw (you get the drift) from them my company does the warranty for 90% of those products they sell. The only major players I do not do warranty for is Dewalt, Makita, Bosch, Milwaulkee and Generac. I have seen what Chinese manufacturing has down very quickly in just the last 3 years to my industry. Look out -- they are coming to every industry and store shelf in America!)

These articles are coming out of the woodwork because HD-DVD needs to change the perspective that they are behind in the rush to be the one format. It is, as I said, fools gold! Just like the BDA announcing that they have won when the only thing they won was taking the lead in discs sales away from HD-DVD -- that too folks is fools gold. Nobody is winning anything here.

But the real world numbers have not changed -- there are more (3 to 4 times more) BD players then HD-DVD players in the world and here in the USA. The BDA continues to lead the HD-DVD group in discs sales even with the nice bump from Transformers. There is no title currently coming out on HD-DVD for the next 3 months that will have the impact on sales for HD-DVD like Transformers did. Maybe Shrek3 -- but I doubt it. Why? Because most HD-DVD fans have stated they are not really interested in animation from Disney and Pixar and they think those studios can't hold a candle to Shrek3? Alot of the titles to buy this XMAS on HD-DVD is from Warner and they will be on BD too. Warner has already stated that even in there catalog BD discs sales outpace HD-DVD disc sales by a 2 to 1 margin. That is not going to change either.

Finally someone from Sony has stepped up and put an end to the BS that was coming from the BDA by admitting that neither side has done much to either extend their lead (BDA) or make up the slack (HD-DVD) and that for the last 6 months sales differances in disc sales has not changed while the change in standalone (with BD creeping up slowly on HD-DVD) not making any appreciable dent in the discs sales ratio.

Bottom line, Toshiba has pulled out every stop in its attemp to finally take over the disc lead from the BDA. With BD having a 2 to 1 lead for the first 9 months of the year they are not going to do it in 2007. Their only hope is that the BDA does NOT drop player prices and that their constant shrilling will make it seem that HD-DVD is winning when they are obviously not.

No company in the lead starts dropping prices of their products to the basement because they are the leader and want to be nice to the consumer. If you believe that then you really do believe in fairy tales. No, what Toshiba did was to dump a product that was not selling because retailers wanted them out of their inventory to make way for the 3rd generation players. It was a bold and a good move by Toshiba to blunt the Disney and Pixar hits coming out the next week. Maybe that is why the new Sony exec is sobering up. Maybe now the BDA will stop alowing Toshiba to keep pulling the rug out from under them. If the BDA would just come out with 2 or 3 sub $200 players maybe we would start seeing a definate direction to the door on the format war. Maybe all the first gen BD players can be sold at the basement prices Toshiba has been pushing and this would finally blunt Toshiba from doing this.

Nobody is winning anything right now. The BDA leads in both discs sales and player sales. The HD-DVD is leading in standalone sales only and that is by less then 10% now ( 53% to 44% with 3% being combo player sales). At the start of 2007 those numbers in January were HD-DVD 73% and BD 27% of standalone sales (neither the PS3 nor the 360 HD-DVD players are used for standalone sales). I don't see this as anyone leading but as the new CEO from Sony has stated -- pretty much a stalemate!

 

[meStevo]

This thread is going to be awesome.

 

[teachsac]

Sounds like back peddling.... Just go out and get an HD DVD player and enjoy HD. It did wonders for Elwaylite

Nah, I said I wouldn't replace my animations (catalog titles) I already have on DVD. I bought the Rat and have Shrek3 on Cue for next week. If it's day/date I will always buy HD.

Who would want a first gen BD player that can't take advantage of "Bonus View". You don't think that would p.o. the consumer when their disc says Bonus view, but can't be accessed on the BD1000, BD1200, BD1400, BDP-S1, BDP 300, BDP500, BDP2000, DMP10/A, LG100, and all the Pioneers 91, 94, 95? This will only work on the BD30, and the coveted Made in ........ Daewoo, PS3 (whenever they get around to it), LG200 and 5000 (provided either of those two companies can do a firmware update correctly). At least J6P's $98 dollar A2 can do all of that.

Now you're on Diogen's "it's the bandwidth folks". Paramount for some reason doesn't want to do TrueHD. They very well could if they wanted to. There is plenty of bandwidth for a movie, TrueHD track, and IME. It has been done in the past and will be done again in the future. Bourne is Universal's major entry into this. They are now doing their movies in TrueHD as promised earlier in the year. Unfortunately, Paramount hasn't followed through yet. Maybe in 08 they will start.

Oh yeah, Paramount was the #1 grossing studio in 07 w/ a 16.2% share, followed by Sony/Columbia (thanks to Sony's one hit wonder SM3), Warner, BV, and Universal. And HD-DVD's exclusives are looking pretty healthy for next year. I for one am looking forward to "The Kingdom" on 12/26. Very good flick.

Universal
American Gangster
Charlie Wilson's War (Tom Hanks and Julia Roberts).
Wanted
The Incredible Hulk
Hellboy II: The Golden Army
Mamma Mia!
The Mummy 3: Tomb of the Dragon Emperor

Paramount/Dreamworks
Bee Movie
Beowulf
Sweeney Todd
1-18-08 (Cloverfield)
The Spiderwick Chronicles
Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
Kung Fu Panda (animated from Dreamworks)
The Love Guru (Mike Myers new comedy)
Tropic Thunder (Spielberg produced Action Comedy with Ben Stiller)
Iron Man

I own both, could care less who wins, but am really getting tired of the C*** that's being spewed around.

S~

Oh and it was me about 9 months ago that said BD needed to come out w/entry level players in order to compete. Look for standalone player sales to increase in HD DVDs favor. Your figure was before the "dumping" of the A2's. Pure Bill speculation. More likely planned out well in advance.

 

[seminole2001]

Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull

You can take that one off the table for hd-dvd. It's Spielberg movie.

 

[gadgtfreek]

wah waaaaaaaaaaaaaah! (in Kyles mom's voice)

 

[teamerickson]

This thread is going to be awesome.

 

[vurbano]

SOmeone please tell Joe that even the HD-A1 outputs 1080i that can be assembled into a perfect 1080p picture with a proper HDTV. There is ZERO difference in the picture from the HD-A1 and the PS3 on a set that does correct inverse telecine. I am sick and tired of his FUD and ignorant fanboys. I can also enjoy higher quality sound TRueHD via 5.1 analog outputs without having to buy a new HDMI reciever. You know I thought that after I purchased the PS3 I would see Joe in a different light but IMO he has just gotten worse. His FUD is even more ridiculous.

 

[teamerickson]

SOmeone please tell Joe that even the HD-A1 outputs 1080i that can be assembled into a perfect 1080p picture with a proper HDTV.

Home Theater: 1080i v. 1080p

 

[JoeSp]

SOmeone please tell Joe that even the HD-A1 outputs 1080i that can be assembled into a perfect 1080p picture with a proper HDTV. There is ZERO difference in the picture from the HD-A1 and the PS3 on a set that does correct inverse telecine. I am sick and tired of his FUD and ignorant fanboys. I can also enjoy higher quality sound TRueHD via 5.1 analog outputs without having to buy a new HDMI reciever. You know I thought that after I purchased the PS3 I would see Joe in a different light but IMO he has just gotten worse. His FUD is even more ridiculous.

You know Vurbano, it is one thing to label something FUD. It is something else to point out the inaccuracies. I pointed out the inaccuracies, the misconceptions and the reality in this post of what has and has not happened in this format war between BD and HD-DVD.

You say that I have gotten worse. Well, take what I stated above and prove that anything I said is a lie. Hell, just prove that one thing I said was a lie. Then label that FUD.

No Sir, your statement about my response as being FUD is exactly what FUD is in case you don't know. FUD is spreading lies, misinformation nor is it misleading for the purpose of covering up the truth. Nothing I have stated is a lie , misinformation nor does it mislead what is going on between the two camps right now. No what IS happening is that you and Diogen have process a campaign of FUD against anything I post including sites with information for those interested in the differances and what is going on in both camps.

Do what I did and show me where I lied or misinformed or mislead anyone in my response to this post. And you know what, something will come from me that has never come from you or Diogen -- a written appology on this board for everyone to read. I stand behind what I say and when I make a mistake I admit it -- what do you do?

 

[JoeSp]

Home Theater: 1080i v. 1080p

There are those who say they can see the differance between 1080i and 1080p and there are others whg say that they can not tell any differance at all. It depends on the HDTV and also it depends on the source providing the picture and it depends on where or not your HDTV has been properly calibrated. And still there is one simple test that everyone can see -- motion and especially fast motion looks better on 1080p then 1080i.

If you have a HDTV in this country you are very fortunate if your set is either 1080i or 1080p but even with 1080p there are very few sets that correctly upconvert any signal to 1080p. In addition, there have been several problems around the country with 1080i broadcasts that do not convert to 1080p very well, creating motion blur, macro blocking and dropped frames from the conversion to 1080p. So we are not there yet. That is why the new upconverting chips like the Realta HQV chip are so desirable in a DVD, HD-DVD or BD player. It is also why there are manufaturers looking to use this technology in newer HDTVs.

Hey, if you like your HDTV then enjoy it. If you are in the market for a new HDTV then by all means, if you can afford it, purchase the nicest 1080p set you can and enjoy yourself. Because both BD and HD-DVD are bring the goods to you for high def viewing.

 

[JoeSp]

Sounds like back peddling.... Just go out and get an HD DVD player and enjoy HD. It did wonders for Elwaylite

Now you're on Diogen's "it's the bandwidth folks".


I have posted the differances between BD and HD-DVD so many times (and that included the differances in bandwith and what that meant in PQ and Audio Quality) in the past year that I have stopped posting the information because everytime I do some HD-DVD fanboy jumps on me and states that the information is useless. I have found that it is better when someone from the HD-DVD side brings up the information like Diogen did to explain why there was no lossless sound track on Transformers. BTW, this did not mean that the HD-DVD Transformers was not a great addition to the HD-DVD library -- it just could of been better and now we know it could of only been better on BD.

Diogen's statement only points out the ability or inablities of HD-DVD more then I could. It also points to the main differances between HD-DVD and BD. It is not only space but bandwith. And for anyone here who does not know what that means -- it is simple, unless HD-DVD comes up with a compression logrithym that uses siginificantly less bandwith to produce a high quality high def picture then when transfering movies to HD-DVD that were shot using High def cameras or considerable CGI there is always going to be a bandwith shortage with HD-DVD that will not go away with more space. Diogen has meantioned improving VC-1 but they have already found out that once you go below about 10 to 12 mbits you no longer have true high def. You have high def lite -- anyone with DirectTV or DishNetwork knows exactly what I mean. BD has NONE of these limitations RIGHT NOW.

The funny thing is that Paramount who came out and said that HD-DVD was the supperior format they then could not say there wasn't enough bandwith on HD-DVD to have a lossless audio track on the disc. In fact it would not of made a differance if they were on a triple layer disc. The very admission would then make them a lier about HD-DVD being the supperior format. Everyone here knows anything about both formats knows that there is plenty of bandwith on BD to have done PCM or DolbyTrueHD or both, but for Paramont to admit to that would also be admiting that indeed HD-DVD is not supperior to BD. And that folks would of been the ballgame.

 

[diogen]

...it depends on where or not your HDTV has been properly calibrated.

The calibration ghost again...
Calibration has as much to do with 1080i/1080p differences as the color of the car with its performance...

And still there is one simple test that everyone can see -- motion and especially fast motion looks better on 1080p then 1080i.

In addition, there have been several problems around the country with 1080i broadcasts that do not convert to 1080p very well, creating motion blur...

Blur is the way to deliver the information about motion to the viewer. The only way. Nothing to do with 1080i/1080p differences.
Combing is the sign of crappy deinterlacing (1080i -> 1080p) but has nothing to do with HD/BD.

In addition, there have been several problems around the country with 1080i broadcasts that do not convert to 1080p very well, creating motion blur, macro blocking and dropped frames from the conversion to 1080p.

Frames are never dropped because of deinterlacing.
Crappy flagged material (due to editing) can triger interlaced fields to be dropped.
Again, has nothing to do with HD/BD.

I have posted the differances between BD and HD-DVD so many times (and that included the differances in bandwith...

Lie. You had no clue what it is less than a month ago.

...everytime I do some HD-DVD fanboy jumps on me and states that the information is useless.

What you post about the difference between HD and BD is useless preaching.

I have found that it is better when someone from the HD-DVD side brings up the information like Diogen did...

Geeez... I can't understand how people type something like this...
Now I believe you have a business degree. At least of the a$$hole type.

Diogen's statement only points out the ability or inablities of HD-DVD more then I could.

You are too modest...

...unless HD-DVD comes up with a compression logrithym that uses siginificantly less bandwith to produce a high quality high def picture then when transfering movies to HD-DVD that were shot using High def cameras or considerable CGI...

Garbage.
CGI is the easiest to compress material. It is almost always short and always clean.
Look up "Elephant's Dream" on doom9.

...there is always going to be a bandwith shortage with HD-DVD that will not go away with more space. Diogen has meantioned improving VC-1 but they have already found out that once you go below about 10 to 12 mbits you no longer have true high def.

Spinning. Mpeg-2 is 10 years old and doubled in efficiency over its lifetime.
What makes you think VC-1 and AVC, being just 1-2 years old, won't do the same.

Since you trademarked the "idiot" term, I'm at a loss how to call this "mentoring" of yours. I think "stupid" would be the closest.
You know, when after weeks of painstaking study, a person admits that 2+2=4 but insists that 2+3=10.

Joe, you are stupid.

Diogen.

 

[vurbano]

Do what I did and show me where I lied or misinformed or mislead anyone in my response to this post. And you know what, something will come from me that has never come from you or Diogen -- a written appology on this board for everyone to read. I stand behind what I say and when I make a mistake I admit it -- what do you do?

Your constant harping of how BD is better because is outputs 1080p vs 1080i is FUD. You either do not understand that 1080i60 is identical to 1080p when reassembled or are just plain trying to mislead, i.e LIE. Is that clear enough for you troll?

 

[toto]

Not to get involved in the war, a couple of words of note: The formats are 1080i/60, 1080p/30, and 1080p/24. Theoretically the best point to switch the digital information would be as far down the pipe as possible. If you have a 1080p set 1080p information would need no scaling but a straight transfer.

 

[ONUOsFan]

We need a new war zone: "Joe vs. the Vurbano" (and Diogen and TeamErickson)

 

[ONUOsFan]

Home Theater: 1080i v. 1080p

I've seen this before, so let me ask a question that is probably really stupid, but serious all the same: if there really is no difference, why do they make both kinds, how can they get away with charging so much more, and why do so many supposedly knowledgeable people on this forum go for the more expensive 1080p models?

 

[mike123abc]

1080p is very useful to bypass poor TV set deinterlacing. Many TV sets fail at getting it right. If you have a TV with a working decoder it can pull the 24fps 1080p image out of the 60fps 1080i image and run with it.

Sets like the sony XBR4/5 take 24p and show it 5x for 120hz without issue. They also seem to lock on to the 1080i signals properly after a few frames and display it properly too. Cheaper sets do not tend to do so well.

 

[gadgtfreek]

1080p is also nice if you want to sit 5ft away from a 65" tv.

 

[vurbano]

I've seen this before, so let me ask a question that is probably really stupid, but serious all the same: if there really is no difference, why do they make both kinds, how can they get away with charging so much more, and why do so many supposedly knowledgeable people on this forum go for the more expensive 1080p models?

Because 1080p looks superior to 1080i30 when viewed at the proper distance. The problem is misinformation reffering to Toshibas HD DVD players as simply 1080i. Blublood FUD trolls and BB pimple faced idiot salesboys state it this way to decieve newbies. "Its only 1080i while the PS3 is 1080p". When the word 1080i is thrown around it is commonly assumed to be 30fps, but Toshiba is outputting 60fps and therefore has all of the picture information that 1080p does.