Setting up my C band, still have (more) questions

[Bluebeard123]

.....and I thought this would be simple just to buy a new receiver and start receiving programs...... Didn't exactly go like that. I found that since I hadn't used my dish in 10 years, there was some rust on the axle of the H2H mount, so I had to unstick that. Then we kept trying to find satellites where we thought they should be and found nothing. I went down to Titanium Satellite and bought a new Lnb for C only and hired a local "satellite guy" to set up my system. I guess I should have gotten a quote from him first. I asked him to find 2 satellites- G23 and the one next to it and I would take it from there. Well, he spent half the day here fussing around and he found me 2 satellites he told me one was G23. Cool, and then i got the bill for $420!!!!

Man.... I am in the wrong business. I started watching my "G23" and found that it was all in spanish, and I soon figured out it wasn't G23, but something else. A little sleuthing around and I think it is a Satmex satellite to the east of South.

So here I sit with my one Satmex xx satellite, now I have to figure out how to use the Amiko Mini HD SE and the ASC1.

I have some questions that maybe you guys can help me with (since I cannot afford to pay another "satellite guy" to come out and help me).

I have watched the online videos of the Amiko several times and have read the manuals for both devices several times. Here are my questions:

1. So I have a single satellite I have found in the sky (Satmex??), my ASC1 counter is at 1100- since this sat is pretty much near the center of the arc, should I make the ASC1 counter closer to 0000, or does it matter?

2. I am guessing now that I have my single satellite, I need to hook up my satellite meter and rotate the dish until I come across another satellite and then do a blind scan on it. Since I don't know which satellite I am coming up on, should I pick an satellite on the Amiko that is, say a European satellite and then set the Amiko to that satellite to do the scan? I am assuming since I don't know which satellite I am on, I want to "test scan" to see which channels are on the next satellite. Once I figure out which satellite it is, I can then come back later and set the Amiko to the correct satellite name to do the proper scan?

What confused me when my "satellite guy" was here was, we assumed we were on G23 and initiated the scan on the Amiko in the G23 scan page. It found a bunch of transponders, but they were all in spanish and then I realized that we, in fact were not on G23, but since the Amiko thought we were there, it recorded all the transponders we found as transponders on G23. So as soon as I realized I wasn't on G23, I wrote down the counter number on the ASC1 and then erased all the transponders I found while I did the search for G23 (since the ones I found were not on that satellite, but the Amiko noted them as being on G23). As I find more satellites, I will record the ASC1 counter numbers on them and once I know what everything is, I will start from the beginning and do searches on the Amiko, using it set on the appropriate satellite. Is this the right way to do this?

The manual assumes you know exactly where every satellite is. It says "go to G19" and do a scan. Well, I don't know where G19 is.

I have an old starchoice (Weinguard) 31" round dish, and I guess I will use that one for my Ku. Does anyone have an old H2H motor that will work with this that they want to sell? I am not feeling as rich as I was on Friday.

 

[wallyhts]

Sorry to here you got hit for $420.

I would call Brian at Titanium 530-652-4405.

 

[KE4EST]

Wow that guy ripped you off, I would fight that.

 

[FTA4PA]

$420, ouch! Well, if you thought you were on Galaxy 23 @ 121 West) but you are getting Spanish programming, then it does seem as though you could be on Satmex 8 (now called Eutelsat 117 West A) @ 116.9 West. If so, you would only need to move a little west to hit Galaxy 23. I am unfamiliar with operation of the ASC1 but you could give what you mentioned a try. If you bump west a bit, blind scan and compare the results you get with the lists on Lyngsat.com, you should be able to tell what sat you are actually pointed at and jot down it's counter position. If you are uncomfortable giving that a try, then definitely give Brian a call as suggested above. Good luck!

 

[ken2400]

Two things.
Do you a single meter? A basic one like my avatar works wonders and is low cost.
Does the sat have a clear view of the sky?

Point the dish around the clearest part of the sky and use the meter to get the strongest signal.
Scan it in and like FTAPA said compare the results to Lyngsat.com and/or http://www.satelliteguys.us/thelist/
Once you get a view channels use the quality meter in the receiver to fine tune the dish.
A compass and a site like http://www.dishpointer.com/
can get you close to a given sat.
From there one hops from sat to sat. It takes time.
Good luck and keep us posted

 

[Bluebeard123]

Sorry to here you got hit for $420.

I would call Brian at Titanium 530-652-4405.

I've been calling him a lot and he has been very helpful, but to tell you the truth, I don't want to be a pest. I think he has given me more than what could be expected of adequate customer service. It's not his fault I don't get it. He has been a real champ and has been going out of his way to help me. He probably has at least several hours in to helping me- at least. I am a big fan of customer service, and Brian has been great, but I think this thing turned into a bigger mess than both of us could have considered. I somehow expected that since my dish was once working, it would be a no-brainer to get it back working. Not the case. And as I noted in an earlier post, I called all the local FTA guys on the FTA list and no one was interested in helping me. One guy from S. Lake Tahoe was interested, but he was out of the country for 2 months, so I would have to wait for him to come back. The other thing is I have been out of it for so long, that the common terminology and concepts that I understood 10 years ago, are in a part of my brain where those neurons haven't fired in a long time, and thus I literally have no clue.

The $420 was a bit over the top, and I know boss of the guy who worked on my sat and maybe I will call him and tell him that the charge was a bit much for his installer who was very familiar with Dish and Direct Tv, but had been out of the C Band arena for several years and was having difficulty finding any sats. There were several issues with my dish: the elevation nut had backed out about 2" over the years, so we didn't know where the proper elevation was. And then we were sweeping the sky for hours and he kept saying "I am getting the signal of the satellite, but I cannot get a lock".

I have a satellite meter, and I am going to hook it up right now to try bumping to the west a bit to see what I get. I am still a little foggy how the ASC1 and the Amiko interface, but I guess I have nothing to lose but to try some stuff to see what happens.

By the way, I have a horizon to horizon view. No obstructions for literally miles. One thing that was weird was when the inline meter was going off and making noise, the meter on the Amiko showed nothing. When we finally found the Satmex satellite, that is when the Amiko's signal strength meters started working. I am not sure I can use the Amiko to find a sat in the sky. I will fiddle a bit more tonight to see what happens.

I will let you guys know. Hopefully after this adventure I will understand it a bit better.

 

[Titanium]

Is the ASC1 LNB voltage setting H:18v V:13v?

Do you still have the 121w channels that we prescanned in the mini HD SE? If so, place the receiver on one of these channels and bring up the service screen with the signal meter. While watching the Signal Quality meter, use the ASC1 to slowly move the dish towards the west.

You should be close enough on the arc to pick-up 121w simply by slowly driving the motor towards the west. Once the prescanned 121w channels are coming in, enter the mini HD SE install menu, turn on the motor DiSEqC 1.2 and set a motor number and save.

 

[Bluebeard123]

I am convinced I am doing everything I can do backwards. So this is what I am doing- (I will try Brian's plan next). I have my pocket sat meter and I am moving the sat to the west with the ASC1, as it tips up on the pocket meter, I stop it and guess which sat it may be (I guess wrong each time), I then choose the sat I think it is on the Amiko satellite installation page (From the preprogrammed list) and then do a blind search from that page. Every single satellite I have guessed, I have guessed wrong. So what that does is when I am done with the search, I have 80 or so channels that are receiving something, but when you go to the channel page, the satellite notation at the bottom of the page shows the wrong satellite, because I guessed the wrong satellite on the sat search page. Soooooooo (and I know this is the realllllllllllllllly slow way to do it- but I cannot find any other way) I then delete all the channels I just found (which is a lot of button pushing on the "organize service" page --- and then post the correct satellite on the search page and then re-download the channels that I just deleted, but now each channel page shows the correct satellite at the bottom. I have been working on this for going on 3 hours and I have successively loaded 2 satellites and deleted (one by one) over 300 channels. The guys who design these products ought to hire me to find the most bozo way to do things. I have looked and looked and I cannot find a way to do a group delete, so I do it one by one. I will re-read Brian's thing a few more times to see if what he is saying makes sense.

 

[Bluebeard123]

Is the ASC1 LNB voltage setting H:18v V:13v?

yes

Do you still have the 121w channels that we prescanned in the mini HD SE? If so, place the receiver on one of these channels and bring up the service screen with the signal meter. While watching the Signal Quality meter, use the ASC1 to slowly move the dish towards the west.

Great!!! Found G23 (121). can I do the same with the others?

You should be close enough on the arc to pick-up 121w simply by slowly driving the motor towards the west. Once the prescanned 121w channels are coming in, enter the mini HD SE install menu, turn on the motor DiSEqC 1.2 and set a motor number and save.

I don't have the choice of 1.2, I two choices with drop downs on each: 1.0 and 1.1 - what do I do?

 

[Bluebeard123]

Brian, your way is a much smarter way to do it than my way. I haven't set the Amiko Diseq motor yet because I am not sure what to do. But I am scanning doing it your way and I am making notes of where on the ASC1 the satellite is located, so I can program it in as soon as I figure out how to set the Diseq. Is there a way to batch delete the channels on the "Organize service" page? Or do I have to delete one by one?

 

[Titanium]

Should I assume that the preprogrammed channels that we scanned on my bench for 121w and 116.8 have been erased? If so, it might be best just to perform a reset all on both the mini and the ASC1 to start with a clean slate. If you go that route, call me and we will do it over the phone.

Have you watched the video that was shot at my test bench of programming a satellite position with the mini and ASC1? It should show the process to use only the mini to set a satellite menu, move the dish via DiSEqC 1.2 and save the position.

There won't be many errors in finding each satellite if you keep an eye on the counter numbers between satellite positions (the count between satellites will be approximately the same across the top of the arc) and always select an active transponder for the satellite you are trying to locate. The process of random blind scanning to identify each satellite when an analog meter squeals would be frustrating.

DiSEqC 1.2 is a selection in the mini HD SE positoner/motor menu. It is below the DiSEqC 1.0 and 1.1 menu lines on the install screen. This must be activated for each satellite and assign a position number as you program.

To erase channels, you may delete the incorrectly scanned transponders (which then also deletes the associated channels). There is an option to select all channels on a satellite for deletion or individual channels as you are now doing. If everything gets messed up go into the System menu and either reset everything or only delete all of the channels.

Watch the video that we shot then call me. I'll walk you though programming a few satellites. Hopefully the installer confirmed the satellite was tracking the entire arc....

 

[Magic Static]

Let me point out one feature of your AJAK. The counts are in 1/10 of a degree. 10 counts equals 1 degree. So 116.8W and 121.0W are 42 counts apart. I found this to be surprisingly accurate across the arc on both my AJAKs. So if you are peaked on one sat, you just need to do the math and move to the next one

 

[bigg t]

The main thing I would be concerned about was like Brian said that the dish would still track the entire ark. In his attempts to get a signal on 123 he may have got everything goofed up where you aren't even close to the correct ark. It would help a lot if you had an angle meter to check the latitude adjustment and elevation setting at true south or the highest position of the mount.

 

[Bluebeard123]

OK, I am limping along here. The latest posts were helpful. I am still doing it bas-akwards, but at least it is working out somewhat. Good to know about the 1/10 of a degree. Here is what I have worked out:

1. The Amiko is still pre-programmed

2. I finally got it to use the pre-programming on the amiko to find the sats. What didn't finally sink into me until this morning (I was up to 2am screwing around with it), was , as Brian stated- "once you find the first satellite, look for an active transponder on the one next door to it (on the Amiko) and then move the satellite to see the peak in the meter". For some reason, the "looking for the active transponder" didn't sink in, so I only picked up the satellites that happened to be noted as the active transponder in the Amiko when I moved the dish (with the ASC1). So I got the majority of them that way, then I went back and used the inline meter to pick up the scragglers. Now, this morning, after sleeping on it, I see the error of my ways. I have a couple of more sats to find, and I will do it the correct way.

So, now with my "modified way" of the "wrong way to find satellites", nothing has been programmed into the Amiko. All the channels I found, I deleted them just to make sure I didn't have a bigger mess, but I noted the sat positions of all the satellites I found on the ASC1. So I have a list of the positions on my desktop. My intention is once I find them all, I plan to go back and program each in. I am still not clear how the Amiko and the Titanium both remember the sat positions, even if you only save it in the Amiko. I need to review the information again. The recording we did at Brian's bench was with him working with Ku and I am doing C, so some of the settings were different, so I still was unsure.

Brian can write me down as the customer from hell. I am a really nice guy, but some things I just don't get. And it looks like this is one of those things.

Brian, thanks for being so helpful, you have gone above and beyond.

 

[kittyhas1000legs]

Brian can write me down as the customer from hell.

Nah. If that were the case, you would be blaming him every step of the way. At least, that's my experience with customers

 

[FTA4PA]

Glad to hear things are coming along for you!

 

[Bluebeard123]

Boy, the best tip was the ajak moving hints. That is the best yet. Thanks, I will note that one.

 

[Titanium]

Far from being a customer from hell! I am 100% in agreement with kittyhas1000legs.I really enjoy helping someone who is trying and learning! Who knows, maybe you will take this knowledge and help the next guy who comes along and needs assistance!

Think of these devices as a team. The ASC1 is a student and the Amiko as the instructor. The Amiko instructs the ASC1 where to point then tells the ACS1 what memory number to store the motor count position. When the Amiko wants to return to that satellite, it looks up the memory number where it told the ASC1 to store the satellite position then instructs the ASC1 to return to that memory number. The ASC1 looks up that memory position and moves the dish until the count position matches.