Red Screen of Death for Blu-Ray

[VinceT3]

You just got to find this amusing.. if you own a blu-ray player you may want to avoid the new movies due to the requirement of BD+

Fox's new Blu-ray titles with BD+ won't playing in all players - Engadget HD

 

[dantheman77]

damn!! i just bought from amazon.

 

[charper1]

So what happened when you followed the instructions to go to get the latest firmware? Or do you happen to have that specific Samsung where there is no new firmware for the next 1 week or so?

 

[GaryPen]

Ironic it's a RED screen, isn't it?

 

[CochiseGuy]

Ironic it's a RED screen, isn't it?

I think Microsoft already has a Trademark on the Blue Screen of Death.


Sorry, couldn't resist.

On a more serious note -

So what happened when you followed the instructions to go to get the latest firmware? Or do you happen to have that specific Samsung where there is no new firmware for the next 1 week or so?

I have an online buddy on another forum with a Samsung 1200 that won't play either FF4 Silver Surfer or Day After Tomorrow. He's called Samsung twice in 3 days. The first time they told him they've never heard of any problems, now they're telling him it's a "known issue" and they're working on an update. They're saying it seems to be Java and new AACS keys that revoked old ones.

 

[dantheman77]

well it must work on some players. fan 4 was reveiwed on high def digest.( dont know to add a link, sorry) and a few members say they saw it too. so im holding ouy hope.

 

[CochiseGuy]

From the AVSForum -

Fantastic Four: RotSS:

PS3 - Load time similar to POTC, but plays OK - with FW 1.82 & higher
Samsung BD-P1000 - can be finicky, some have stuttering
Samsung BD-P1200 - get a screen saying to update firmware, will not play
Samsung 1400 - Plays OK, long load time
LG BH100 - reports that it doesn't work
Pioneer - Plays OK, long load time
Sony - Plays OK, long load time
Panny - Plays OK, long load time

 

[vurbano]

R.I.P. BlurRay

 

[CochiseGuy]

well it must work on some players. fan 4 was reveiwed on high def digest.( dont know to add a link, sorry) and a few members say they saw it too. so im holding ouy hope.

Here's the latest news story from HighDefDigest -

Playback Problems Reported on 'Silver Surfer,' 'Day After Tomorrow' Blu-ray Discs
Thu Oct 04, 2007 at 11:00 AM ET
Tags: Technical Glitches, Fox (all tags)

Two of the most eagerly anticipated next-gen releases in recent memory have hit a series of playback snags on select Blu-ray players, but a fix is said to be on the way.

As we've previously reported, 'Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer' and 'Day After Tomorrow' (both released this past Tuesday) mark the first Blu-ray releases from Fox Home Entertainment following a six month sabbatical.

But while the discs have generally been well-received (our own Peter Bracke raved about the audio/video quality in his review of 'Silver Surfer'), what was initially a cause for celebration has become an exercise in frustration for some Blu-ray fans as incompatibility issues with some players have hindered playback of the discs.

The most severe problems have been reported on Samsung's BDP-1200 and LG's BH100, which are both said to be incapable of playing back the discs at all. Less catastophic issues (error messages and playback stutter) have been reported for Samsung's BDP-1000. The discs appear to play back fine on all other Blu-ray players (including the PlayStation 3), although users have reported lengthy load times of up to two minutes.

It has been widely speculated that these issues stem from the use of BD+ copy protection on the two discs. We contacted Fox for comment, but so far there's no official word from the studio.

Calls placed to both Samsung and LG customer support revealed that both manufacturers are aware of the issue, and that both are working on firmware updates to correct it. Samsung promised a firmware update within "a couple" weeks, while LG said an update is expected in 3-4 days.

We'll keep you posted when/if any official statements are released by Fox or any of the manufacturers involved. In the meantime, we've set up a dedicated thread in our Forums area to discuss playback problems with both the 'Silver Surfer' and 'Day After Tomorrow' discs.

Stay tuned...

 

[berck]

This is from Paidgeek

I have some recent information that the playability problems with TDAT and F4 are not related to BD+, but instead have to do with the Java support on the players in question. The firmware updates should resolve it.

 

[VinceT3]

actually that's pretty funny.. IE & Netscape had that issue years ago.. multiple version of Java and no one could come up with a consistant version that worked the same regardless of hardware/software..

I wonder if BD is going to be stuck in that same boat? If you haven't noticed everyone jumped off the java ship online and went towards something that works consistantly like shockwave, learned to work around the issues, or just went with simplier CSS apps..

 

[JoeSp]

If you had a PS3 you would not be seeing these screens.

 

[harshness]

IE & Netscape had that issue years ago.. multiple version of Java and no one could come up with a consistant version that worked the same regardless of hardware/software..

Are you making the silly mistake of confusing Java and Javascript?

 

[JoeSp]

Sun Microsystems and Microsoft have been battling this out for over a decade. Neither one has been able to displace the other. Both products by these companies have their good and bad qualities and both are widely used on the internet. I have said this many times - competition is good -- no competition is bad. There needs to be competition to drive innovation and to improve product performance. These two giants have been trying to push the envelope for years and their products have constantly improved. Why not wait a few months till BD-Java 1.1 has been out and has been used for awhile and then decide if the choice was right for the format.

And lets stop the talk of first generation BD players not being completely compliant. First generation HD-DVD players are still having problems with some HD-DVD combo discs. This product has been out for a year and still there are movies released in the format that have problems on first gen players. First generation players are always not going to be fully featured (first gen HD-DVD players that do not have HDMI, 1080p , 24fps output) and they will always be replaced as they are usually purchased by early adopters who know that they are guinea pigs of new product. So lets not be the kettle calling the pot black. We all know that our first gen players are going to be replaced with 2nd or 3rd generation players that have better build quality, more features, and lower costs then the first gen product. You are not fooling anyone if you claim a first generation player is going to be as fully featured as a second or third generation player.

 

[teachsac]

Sun Microsystems and Microsoft have been battling this out for over a decade. Neither one has been able to displace the other. Both products by these companies have their good and bad qualities and both are widely used on the internet. I have said this many times - competition is good -- no competition is bad. There needs to be competition to drive innovation and to improve product performance. These two giants have been trying to push the envelope for years and their products have constantly improved. Why not wait a few months till BD-Java 1.1 has been out and has been used for awhile and then decide if the choice was right for the format.

And lets stop the talk of first generation BD players not being completely compliant. First generation HD-DVD players are still having problems with some HD-DVD combo discs. This product has been out for a year and still there are movies released in the format that have problems on first gen players. First generation players are always not going to be fully featured (first gen HD-DVD players that do not have HDMI, 1080p , 24fps output) and they will always be replaced as they are usually purchased by early adopters who know that they are guinea pigs of new product. So lets not be the kettle calling the pot black. We all know that our first gen players are going to be replaced with 2nd or 3rd generation players that have better build quality, more features, and lower costs then the first gen product. You are not fooling anyone if you claim a first generation player is going to be as fully featured as a second or third generation player.

1. All HD-DVD player have HDMI, including Gen 1.
2. Most first/second gen BD players don't support 1080p/24 either.
3. And some first/second gen BD players can't play BD+ titles from Fox at all (AACS? maybe, but....). All other machines have shown slow downs in load times (including my Panasonic. At least they play). Don't you think you would test a title on all available players before putting it out rather than blaming the Hardware manufacturers? There has never been an HD-DVD disc that would not play on any HD-DVD player.
4. The only two discs that showed any real problems than with more than a handful of gen 1 owners were COM and The Good Shepard. Universal replaced these titles for free. Most other users simply washed their discs and they played fine.

S~

 

[mike123abc]

actually that's pretty funny.. IE & Netscape had that issue years ago.. multiple version of Java and no one could come up with a consistant version that worked the same regardless of hardware/software..

I wonder if BD is going to be stuck in that same boat? If you haven't noticed everyone jumped off the java ship online and went towards something that works consistantly like shockwave, learned to work around the issues, or just went with simplier CSS apps..

Sun won that battle in court. Microsoft had their own language they called "java". It was not compatible with Sun's. Sun sued, MS lost. Now you download java from Sun and it works fine. It was typical MS, take a standard, change it enough to be incompatible (they were "enhancing" it), and get developers writing to their enhancements, making the programs only run on MS software...

 

[JoeSp]

1. All HD-DVD player have HDMI, including Gen 1.
2. Most first/second gen BD players don't support 1080p/24 either.
3. And some first/second gen BD players can't play BD+ titles from Fox at all (AACS? maybe, but....). All other machines have shown slow downs in load times (including my Panasonic. At least they play). Don't you think you would test a title on all available players before putting it out rather than blaming the Hardware manufacturers? There has never been an HD-DVD disc that would not play on any HD-DVD player.
4. The only two discs that showed any real problems than with more than a handful of gen 1 owners were COM and The Good Shepard. Universal replaced these titles for free. Most other users simply washed their discs and they played fine.

S~

The only BD players that are having a playback problem are the ones from Korea - Samsung and LG. Both have promised firmware upgrades that will eliminate this problem.

There have been several complaints that the 300 HD-DVD title is freezing in some first generation HD-DVD players. They obviously have not eliminated all of their problems with the HD-DVD combo discs either.

Washed their discs? All I do is put a BD in my PS3 and it has never failed to play, has frozen or has not played some content on the disc. And I don't have to 'wash' my discs.

ALL BD players support 1080p 60fps thru their HDMI port. Most with a firmware upgrade now support 24fps output. I have not read of one second generation BD player that does not support 24fps output with a firmware upgrade.

On top of this BD is moving ahead with DTS-HD Master decoding and bitstream passing of this codec on HDMI. New players coming out are either decoding or passing the bitstream to the receiver. Some of the older players are going to be doing the same with a firmware upgrade. I have not read where HD-DVD is moving in this direction?

Bottom line, both formats are continuing to mature - add features - improve on features and improve build quality. Both have had hiccups and continue to. BD continues to improve and has considerable room for improvement and upgrade. That is not a problem but a planned path for product improvement that is already laid out. For BD supporters like myself -- it is comforting to know that the BD format is not done improving and adding features and continues to evolve. I look forward to the future of BD as do others.

 

[teachsac]

The only BD players that are having a playback problem are the ones from Korea - Samsung and LG. Both have promised firmware upgrades that will eliminate this problem.

There have been several complaints that the 300 HD-DVD title is freezing in some first generation HD-DVD players. They obviously have not eliminated all of their problems with the HD-DVD combo discs either.

Washed their discs? All I do is put a BD in my PS3 and it has never failed to play, has frozen or has not played some content on the disc. And I don't have to 'wash' my discs.

ALL BD players support 1080p 60fps thru their HDMI port. Most with a firmware upgrade now support 24fps output. I have not read of one second generation BD player that does not support 24fps output with a firmware upgrade.

On top of this BD is moving ahead with DTS-HD Master decoding and bitstream passing of this codec on HDMI. New players coming out are either decoding or passing the bitstream to the receiver. Some of the older players are going to be doing the same with a firmware upgrade. I have not read where HD-DVD is moving in this direction?

Bottom line, both formats are continuing to mature - add features - improve on features and improve build quality. Both have had hiccups and continue to. BD continues to improve and has considerable room for improvement and upgrade. That is not a problem but a planned path for product improvement that is already laid out. For BD supporters like myself -- it is comforting to know that the BD format is not done improving and adding features and continues to evolve. I look forward to the future of BD as do others.

You need to do your research before you post. 1080p/60 is not what you said in your original usual posts. The A20, XA2, A30, and A35 all support 1080p. The A35 and a30 support 1080p/24 flawlessly. The A20 and XA2 will get a firmware update to improve their 1080p/24 support similar to what the Pioneer and PS3 received after they had issues with their first update, also. The Onkyo will also support 1080p/24. Toshiba is supporting bitstream in their A35 and it is coming soon to the XA2. The Onkyo is going to support this feature also. Will the PS3? No. It might support internal decoding though. After a year of listening to "Just wait, it's coming soon", it's still not even in the rumor mill.

Will any Gen 1 or Gen 2 BD player support interactivity? No. How is a planned path good for the consumer that leaves its base out of the mix? All of these players/consumers are going to be left out, especially from studios that play up and rely on interactivity.

A handful of people had problems with 300. Not overwelming. You can go to the BD software forum and find a handful of people that have problems, too, and they're not even combos, even with the beloved PS3. You must remember that BD could not get the combos to work. Yes they tried and yes it was an option being looked at.

S~

Oh and Joe,

The new Sony 2000ES and 500 only support DTS-High Resolution output over bitstream (and internal decoding). Some Elite Series.

Sony Electronics News and Information

 

[VinceT3]

Are you making the silly mistake of confusing Java and Javascript?

umm.. no..

back in the day when Netscape was around version 2/3ish and IE was I think version 3? They had a big issue, and no it wasn't the fact that microsoft had additional functions in their version of java, it was a serious flaw in everyones varied versions of java.. even sun didn't get it right between unix and windows..

it's been taken care of now that no one but sun really makes the java run time anymore (at least as far as I know) which really helped stop most of the incompatabilties..

I was with a company that eventually abandoned Java on the client for Javascript and CSS along with another few nifty "not exactly why that was put in there" features of the browsers to make some really cool apps..

 

[harshness]

Sun won that battle in court. Microsoft had their own language they called "java".

I could have sworn that M$ called it "J++" (subsequently "J#"). The pissing match was over the M$ JVM that I'm pretty sure was removed from Windows distributions years ago.