Pansat 6000HXC setup help

[plimzol]

It's been a few months back that I got the FTA bug. Slowly, when discretionary funds became available, I have purchased the components. Next week, I hope, the last pieces will get here. So next weekend I hope to be actually installing the system. The components are:
Pansat 6000HXC
Invacom QPH31
85cm DISH (skyvision)
STAB HH120
250' RG6 (run to the house 75')
F connectors
75 ohm terminators
DiSEqC switch 4x1 S-DS41C (Sadoun)
Splitters (one port power passing)

I have BUD experience only. But in my defense, I have had to break down and re-install the dish on three occasions (job relocations over the past 25 years). So I am not totally unfamilar with dish alignment (still just an amatuer though). My Bud is used with a 4DTV where I get my subscription channels. Both C-band an Ku.

From what I have already read, the alignment of the dish, motor mount, and post are identical to that of a large dish. Post must be absolutely plumb. Motor must be at it's zero point and adjusted for site latitude. Dish horizontaly aligned with the motor zero point. Dish elavation adjusted according to the declination correction. All aligned to true South. Since my meridian is 122.3 degees west longitude, G10R would be my SMS (a new acronym?) southern most satellite. It's almost dead on at 122.9 degrees west longitude.

I would like to thank all the people who have read this so far and are still reading. What you have just experienced is what we like to call the newbie effect. This is where we tell you all the things we think we know so you won't think we are complete dorks. If you have any strength left, hang on, because we are quickly coming to the things that I do not know. Legion, we are many. I'm old, I ramble. God bless President Roosevelt.

I planned on sitting up on the roof, next to the dish set up, with a small tv and the pansat reciever. It's nice on the roof. Beautiful view and quiet. Sorry.. sorry. A connection from a single liner output (Invacom QPH31) to the pansat 1 IF in. Coax from pansat tv out to the portable tv for alignment. Here is what I don't know or rather muddled about.

When I turn the pansat on for the first time I am assuming that the factory bins have already been loaded? If not how do I check.

If it has been loaded, what would be the menu selections I would need to select and modify to prepare to recieve a signal from G10R.


thank you for your patience,

plimzol

 

[Mr Tony]

From what I have already read, the alignment of the dish, motor mount, and post are identical to that of a large dish. Post must be absolutely plumb. Motor must be at it's zero point and adjusted for site latitude. Dish horizontaly aligned with the motor zero point. Dish elavation adjusted according to the declination correction. All aligned to true South. Since my meridian is 122.3 degees west longitude, G10R would be my SMS (a new acronym?) southern most satellite. It's almost dead on at 122.9 degrees west longitude.

you got it right so far You have to take your magnetic declination into effect too as to where in the sky to aim the dish/motor

I planned on sitting up on the roof, next to the dish set up, with a small tv and the pansat reciever. It's nice on the roof. Beautiful view and quiet.

still looking good

A connection from a single liner output (Invacom QPH31) to the pansat 1 IF in. Coax from pansat tv out to the portable tv for alignment.

yep. So far so good

When I turn the pansat on for the first time I am assuming that the factory bins have already been loaded? If not how do I check.

factory software is in there from the getgo and will work just fine

If it has been loaded, what would be the menu selections I would need to select and modify to prepare to recieve a signal from G10R.

see the picture below. Don't hook up the switch yet. There are 2 transponders you could use to get the signal quality. See this link for an active transponder
http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=85225


see the below picture. That will have the settings you need for LNB LO frequency and the rest of the settings

 

[plimzol]

Thanks Iceberg. I'll be back when It's aligned for the best setup advise.

plimzol

 

[plimzol]

Hi all

Hi all,

I know I'm jumping the gun. Please forgive my enthusiasm. I've been looking forward to this day (doing this in my mind) for sometime and the day is almost here, Saturday. The dish got here today (85cm samsonic). All the pieces are here. I am going to align the dish, motor etc. according to the previous posts on G10r. My southern most satellite. My question is;
if I am successful the next logical steps. Don't answer just yet. Please keep reading

To digress, I will align the dish with the zero point of the STAB HH120 rotor. I will adjust the dish elavation according to manf. recommendation for my position. I will have L.O. and tp settings correct in the pansat 6000 rcv to receive the strongest signal. And I will adjust the whole unit (motor and dish together, dish locked to the zero point of the motor and LNBF zero skew,that is straight up and down) adjusting right or left; dish up or down (in one degree increments); until the strongest quality signal is recieved. I have an advatage that my c-band setup is onlly 30' away, which gives me a good idea for the angle to G10r and true south.

If I am successful in peaking the dish, the time to check the track of satellites on the clarke belt has arrived. If I have done this accurately, I should be .6 degrees west of south. Not a whole lot. A rap of the screwdiver. Yes I'm stalling, because if I understand what I've read, the next step is to correctly connect the DiSeqC switch (SADOUN DiSEqC 4X1 S-DS41C) to the LNB's - Motor - Receiver.

I would like to go over the switch setup first. Because I want to record channels that may be lineral vertical/horizontal; circular right or left (different setting from what is viewed on the TV) I will need to connect all outputs fron the Invacom QPH31 to all inputs of the switch. The output of the switch should be connect to the LNB input of the motor. The output of the motor should be connected to 1 IF input on the pansat. The 1 IF output on the pansat should be connected to the 2 IF input.

The pansat has DiSEqc 1.2 and USALS for motor positioning. I'm assuming that DiSEqC 1.2 would be the correct choice. Is this correct?
I'm assuming at this point when a satellite is selected the correct lnb will be used, the motor will slew to the correct position, and if the active tp is selected for that satellite, a minor correction east or west up or down on the dish for the strongest quality signal.

plimzol

 

[Mr Tony]

Yes I'm stalling, because if I understand what I've read, the next step is to correctly connect the DiSeqC switch (SADOUN DiSEqC 4X1 S-DS41C) to the LNB's - Motor - Receiver.

correct

I would like to go over the switch setup first. Because I want to record channels that may be lineral vertical/horizontal; circular right or left (different setting from what is viewed on the TV) I will need to connect all outputs fron the Invacom QPH31 to all inputs of the switch.

nope. You only need 1 output from the L side and one from the C side to the switch.

The output of the switch should be connect to the LNB input of the motor. The output of the motor should be connected to 1 IF input on the pansat. The 1 IF output on the pansat should be connected to the 2 IF input.

if you want to use both tuners independent of each other (ie: opposite polarity), you would need to run 2 lines from the dish. You have it partially right above. You would need 2 diseqc switches (or for the 2nd tuner, just use the L side.

receiver tuner 1-----------motor-----------diseqc-------------LNB (one from C and one from L)
receiver tuner 2--------------------------------------------------LNB (or put a diseqc on here and duplicate)

The way you have it posted above (going to tuner 1 and looping out to tuner 2) wont allow to record 2 programs on opposite polarity

The pansat has DiSEqc 1.2 and USALS for motor positioning. I'm assuming that DiSEqC 1.2 would be the correct choice. Is this correct?

either will work. USALS you put in your lat & long and the reciver goes to the satellites. 1.2 allows you to fine tune where the motor stops (I use 1.2 but lots of people use USALS)

I'm assuming at this point when a satellite is selected the correct lnb will be used, the motor will slew to the correct position, and if the active tp is selected for that satellite, a minor correction east or west up or down on the dish for the strongest quality signal.

plimzol

I think you mean skew but yes you are correct

 

[Anole]

nice sticky ?

This is such a detailed discussion, both questions and answers, it might be made into a sticky FAQ for first-timers.
Change the title and get rid of any extraneous comments (like this one of mine) and you'd be pretty good to go.
Just wait 'till we see if Plimzol runs into any problems...


....oh, and I don't think he meant skew...

 

[plimzol]

You are correct. My last question would have been clearer if I had just asked, " How does the pansat know to use the output from the circular LNB when on a circular satellite or the output from the linear LNB when on a linear satellite since the output from both are coming thru a single line from the DiSEqC switch? "

plimzol

P.S. 24 hrs. and counting.

 

[Das Hammer]

From what I have already read, the alignment of the dish, motor mount, and post are identical to that of a large dish. Post must be absolutely plumb. Motor must be at it's zero point and adjusted for site latitude. Dish horizontaly aligned with the motor zero point. Dish elavation adjusted according to the declination correction. All aligned to true South. Since my meridian is 122.3 degees west longitude, G10R would be my SMS (a new acronym?) southern most satellite. It's almost dead on at 122.9 degrees west longitude.
plimzol

Your larger C band dish is most likely prime focus. The 85cm is an offset, which means even if they are both pointed at the same bird, the big dish will appear to be aiming a lot higher than the small one. Something to think about...

 

[plimzol]

Roger that Das, and thank you for your reply. You are correct. My C-Band dish is prime focus. Again I am guilty of not being completely clear in my posts. I was refering to the proxcimity of my c-band dish to where I plan to install the FTA system (the c-band dish is already locked on G10r). It will give me the the azimuth reference (horizontal) to true south. I will set the dish angle as per manf. recommendation for latitude and start the search for the G10r signal from there.

Your post however leads me to another question. Let me explain. We have a few million people in this state that have been praying for rain in the past weeks. It looks like that higher power has decided to answer their prayers. I'm sitting here with the Invacom QPH31 in my lap watching the raindrops bounce off the surface of the patio. I've been watching Shelia (I think her name is Shelia. I have, of course, been refering to her by another name.) on the weather channel. Shelia, smiling and using terms the youngest child could understand, has demonstrated (using the latest technology;doppler radar etc.) that my chances of getting up on the roof this weekend will be slim to none. I have made up my mind. Come heck or high water, I'm putting this dish together just as soon as I help take the Christmas tree down tomorrow (yes it's still up. The lights, I hate the lights). I couldv'e gotten out of this but for the rain. Never mind.

Here comes the question. When I'm sitting crosslegged (a good trick in itself for a man my age) in the middle of the family room tomorrow, putting the dish together (Samsonic 85cm) and I want to measure the focal distance to the LNB (just to get it close before I take it outside) where would be the "Sa" point on the dish (in a prime focus dish that would be the ceter of the dish).

Before I post, I would like to thank Iceberg again for his timely and succinct replies.

plimzol

 

[Tron]

For the most part, the LNBF support arm (and holder) place the LNBF in its proper position in relation to the dish. However, when you are tweaking your dish for the best signal (I strongly advise you do this once the rain has stopped), you may find that sliding the LNBF in toward the dish or out away from it a little may increase your signal quality.

Good luck with the weather (and the install)!

 

[plimzol]

Thank you Tron. I need all the help I can get. If, or hopefully when I get a strong signal on G10r, I will slide the LNBF in its' mount a little toward the dish and a little bit away from the dish (making sure it is still straight up and down which is its' zero scew position). I'll do this until I get the highest quality reading and lock it down.

plimzol

 

[plimzol]

I made it out today. Enough time between the raindrops to get the post installled. Had enough time to construct a backstay for the post to compensate for the weight of the motor and dish. The mast is perfectly plumb. Had to leave when St. Elmo's fire started appearing on my level.
The lightning was at least a half mile away. I don't understand. In any case, I'll be out tomorrow if the weather permits and see if I can at least lock on to G10r with a strong signal.

plimzol

 

[Tron]

Had to leave when St. Elmo's fire started appearing on my level.

Make sure that you properly ground the entire setup once its installed! Don't want that going down your cable to the receiver

If you have a motorized setup, skew should be '0' (center, no skew). If you're aiming a fixed dish at G-10R, you'll want to skew the LNBF depending on your geographic location.

 

[plimzol]

Thanks for the reply Tron,

Sorry about the late post. I should have come out of the rain sooner on Saturday. Spent all Sunday in bed with a cold cursing my bad luck. I have indeed grounded the mount. I have a copper grounding wire connect to one of the mounting bolts on the post. I ran it to the nearest cold water pipe (galvanized) and clamped it down. My ground stake is way over on the other side of the house and is not practical to get to. This will indeed be a motor installation (zero scew lnbf, zero on the motor, and the dish aligned with the motors' zero point).

I was at the point on Saturday afternoon, where I was about to attempt this, when I ran into my first glitch. I wanted to check the fit of the motor shaft into the sleeve that directly connents to the back of the dish (also has the dish deflection bracket attached). I realized that the motor shaft diameter was a bit larger. Not a job stopping problem, I thought, I'll just remove the three clamping bolts down the back and the bolt across the top (keeps the sleeve from sliding down the shaft) and pull it open a bit. Easy to do and it does now fit nicely over the motor shaft. Obviously the fever from the cold had taken hold because now all the bolts were too short! So feeling better I'm off to the hardware store this week and will resume the install this weekend.


plimzol

 

[plimzol]

Gearing up for the intstallation tomorrow (finally). I feel fairly confident as far as the alignment on G10r (direction to true south), the transponder to use and the settings in the pansat 6000hxc reciever (thanks to iceberg). Assuming I have got a strong quality signal do I do a scan at that point? If so, what type of scan? After the scan does the satellite (G10r) have to be saved? Is the next step to shut down (remaining on G10r), then remove the connection between the linear out of the Inavacom and Pansat 6000hxc and to connect a circular and linear output of the LNBF to a DiSEqC switch. Then connect the output from the DiSEqC switch to the LNB in on the STAB HH120 LNB connection. Then connect fron the REC connection on the STAB HH120 to the 1 IF connection on the Pansat 6000hxc. How do the Pansat values change. Should I now turn on the 22 khz? should I now turn on DiSEqC 1.2 ; positioner setting? I'm more than likely biting off more than I can chew in a day, but I would realy like to get this up and running in the next two days. Perhaps with your help I will.

plimzol

 

[Tron]

I believe blind scan is called 'Smart Scan' or 'Smart Search' on all Pansats. Use that scanning option, it will find all transponders/channels, not just the ones preprogrammed into the box.

Always unplug your receiver when connecting or disconnecting switches and LNBFs. 22k should be off unless you're using a 22k switch. One option is to ditch the DiSEqC switch and use a 22k 4 x 4 multiswitch. This will switch between both polarities of C and L outputs, and feed up to four receivers (since the 6000 has two tuners it counts as two receivers).

Set the 4 x 4 switch up as follows: Connect the two linear outs from the Invacom to the 13v/0k and 18v/0k inputs of the 4 x 4. Connect the two circular outputs from the Invacom to the 13v/22k and 18v/22k inputs of the 4 x 4. One of the four 4 x 4 outputs will go to the LNB connector on the motor and then from the motor to your primary receiver. The other outputs will go straight to your other receivers (only one receiver can control the motor). Set circular sats as '22k on' in your receiver setup and linear to '22k off'. In this setup, DiSEqC would be off.

 

[plimzol]

Thank you Tron for your post. Once again I'm late to reply and for that I apoligize.

Finally made it out on Saturday before the big game to finish installing the dish. The previous weekend I installed the post and made sure it was perfectly plumb and solid (so it wouldn't flex with the weight of the dish and motor). With the pole up and ready to go I decided to determine the direction to true south ala Indiana Jones (requires the sun, a stick, a ball of string, and a minute of your time. The magic crystal is optional.) to draw a true south reference line on the ground from the pole. That done I completed assembling the dish, LNBF, and motor. All set to their zero point. I then adjusted the motor mount to my latitude. I adjusted the dish offset to the calculated value. I mounted the entire assembly onto the post and aligned everything horizontally to the true south reference line I created and drew on the ground. Connected a single linear output to the Pansat 6000hxc 1 IF in. Connected the TV out to a small portable TV. Switched everything on and hit menu on the pansat remote. Selected English from the menu. Selected Antenna setup and adjusted the setting to the recommended values (see Icebergs previous post to me this thread). Hit the sig button on the remote to active the audible tone. Was already recieveing a small value of signal strength but no quality value. Went to the Dish. Loosened the nuts that secure the dish offset value. Decreased the angle of the offset by a degree maybe less "WE HAVE TONE"! At this point it was a simple matter to adjust the offset to the greatest "QUALITY" value (up/down). And then adjusting twist (azimuth) right or left (very small movements), again keeping the QUALITY value as high as posible. When I figured I had it peaked as best I clould, I locked everything down and did a smart scan and there they were; all the FTA channels one should expect to see on G10r. This where I am at this moment.

Let me digress for a moment. My setup is a STAB HH120; 33" offset dish; Invacom QPH 31 (2 circular 2 linear standard outputs); Pansat 6000hxc reciever. My dish is aligned to my southern most satellite (G10r which is exactly my longitude, lucky me). To peak the dish I used a single linear output to the reciever; bypassing the motor. Getting in the 90's strength and 80's quality after a smart scan. I'm pretty sure I have it peaked. All the FTA channels that should be there, are there.
I now want to check how it tracks the clarke belt and the other satellites. I wish to try 119 first. It's a circular polorized satellite (correct me if I'm wrong). I have a 4x1 DiSEqC. Inputs labeled sat 1, sat2, sat3, sat4. I am only interested (for now) in a single circular and a single linear output. The other two will be terminated (75 ohm terminator). The connections, if I understand correctly, would be one circular output to sat1 and one linear output to sat2 (the other two will have the terminators attached). Out from the DiSEqC to the LNB connection on the STAB motor. On the STAB motor the REC connection goes to the 1 IF connection on the Pansat 6000hxc reciever.

Here is where I need help. I have read that the output from each LNB has to be identified by a tone burst (set on the reciever) in order for the reciever to recognize which output to use (circular or linear). I have looked thru the menus and find no such selection. Have I missed it? Or is this not required on the pansat 6000hxc. I understand that both circular and linear are standard outputs. The L.O. setting for the linear 10750. The L.O. setting for the circular 11250. Is this setting all the pansat requires to determine the correct intput?

This leads me to a second question. When I choose the method to use the dish motor, I can select either DiSEqC 1.2 or USALS. Which should I choose. Does one have advantages over the other.

plimzol

 

[Das Hammer]

Is this setting all the pansat requires to determine the correct intput?

You need to tell it which diseqc port. If you want it to use the circular part of the lnbf, then you would setup 119 in the 6000's menu with diseqc value of 1 because the circular lnbf is connected to the diseqc switch at port 1. Tone burst is not applicable here.

This leads me to a second question. When I choose the method to use the dish motor, I can select either DiSEqC 1.2 or USALS. Which should I choose. Does one have advantages over the other.

plimzol

USALS is awesome if you have everything setup correctly. You'll input your lat and long into the USALS menu. From there, the pansat knows how far to turn the motor for ANY satellite in your visible arc (or within the physical limits of the motor). If you're sitting on 123 G10R now, just setup 119 with USALS (and diseqc port mentioned above) and tell it to use USALS. Do a scan and the motor should move spot on to 119. If it moves, but you're not on 119 then something is amiss.

With normal Diseqc 1.2, you have to manually move the motor with the remote to the right place (requires that you have a live TP entered into each bird you want so you know when you hit it) and then "Save" each position in the 6000's memory. There should be an option to do this in the 1.2 setup. It's been a while since I used a 6000 so I can't tell you how exactly to get there, but the principle is the same from receiver to receiver.

The HH120 is a good motor, moves a bit slower and has less rotation than the HH100, but never had a bit of trouble with mine.

 

[plimzol]

Thank you hammer!

plimzol

 

[plimzol]

Once again I'm late to reply. At least I'm consistant. More rain and job demands delayed my installation. Let me pick up the install where I left off.

I had aligned the motor/dish (both aligned to their zero points, dish declination set and motor set to latitude) to a true south reference line. By the way, reading my previous post, I think some people will think I'm joking about how I got the true south reference. I am not. If the sun is out, you can get a true south reference line (in the northern hemisphere). Accurate to within a degree with nothing more than a vertical stick and a ball of string. It has to do with what is call meridan passage or local apparent noon for all you mariners out there. If anybody is interested I would be happy to explain how to do it. It truly takes only a minute and you can throw away those mag compasses and variation charts. Why professional installers don't use this method on sunny days boggles the mind. I guess it dosen't look technical enough.

That said, with the connections as my previous post, I locked on to G10r. Now I'm ready ready to see if the motor and dish will track the rest of the satellites in the clarke belt. As per Das's recomendations, I powered down the system. Unplugged everything. Disconnected all previous connections. Now for the reconnect (I want both circular and linear polarized sat's).

Connected one linear output fron the Ivacom QPH 31 LNBF to the lnb(sat)1 connection on the 4x1 DiSEqC (SADOUN S-DS41c). Connected one circular output from the Invacom QPH 31 to the lnb(sat)2 connection on the 4x1 DiSEqC (SADOUN S-DS41C). Put 75 ohm terminators on the lnb(sat)3 and lnb(sat)4 connections on the 4x1 DiSEqC (SADOUN S-DS41C).

From the out on the 4x1 DiSEqC (SADOUN S-DS41C) I connected to the LNB connection on the STAB HH 120 motor. From the REC connection on the STAB HH 120 motor I connected to the 1 IF on the Pansat 6000HXC. And finally, from the TV OUT on the Pansat 6000HXC to the tv. Powered everthing up (holding breath).

G10r is still there. All previous scanned channels, still there. Just in case, or rather to save the position of G10r using USALS, (In antenna setup) I select G10r again, LNB power on, LNB Freq. 10750, 22KHz. OFF, TP Freq. 11720, DiSEqc port 1 (linear output fron the DiSEqc 4x1 is connected to lnb(sat)1), Motor USALS (at this point I had to enter my latitude and longitude; please remmember my longitude is the same as G10r for what follows). Pressed OK. No change. G10r is still there with all the expected channels. Satellite saved. Now for Echostar 7.

Return to the atenna setup. This time I select Echostar 7. Settings; LNB power ON, LNB type STANDARD, LNB Freq. 11250 (circular polarity), 22 KHz. OFF, TP Freq 12224, DiSEqC port 2 (circular output from the IVACOM QPH 31 connected to the lnb(sat)2 connection on the DiSEqC 4x1), Motor USALS (My Lat. Long. required). Patience...motor slews......slews.....slews.....slews.....slews....LOCK ON!! 93% "QUALITY". Now for a SMART Scan. Several minutes later I'm watching the NASA channel. Next, "to make a long story short".

I will admit that the search for the rest of the satellites in the Clarke belt went on hold for about an hour as I watched the NASA channel. When I resumed the search (following the above procedure) all the rest of the pre-programmed satellites in the Pansat 6000HXC, from AMC 5 in the East to Echostar 1/2 in the West, fell right into place with using USALS (QUALITY in the 90's). I attribute this to the two days I spent making sure the mounting pole was plumb and supported (struts installed to prevent any deflection of the mounting pole due to dish/motor weight).

I need to thank all those wonderful people here that took the time to offer assistance to me. This install would have been frustrating and not nearly as much fun as it has been. I'm still engaged in minor tweaking and there are a few more satellites that I wish to explore using the Pansat 6000HXC. When done, Installation Part II Begins; Viewsat Ultra.

plimzol