Mini-Bud is back!

[northgeorgia]

Well, the rain has settled in for a few days, so we'll see what happens I put on the C-band lnbf, but unfortunately, my microHD decided to go into a cycle (yeah, I finally put the new firmware from Aug. 29 back on, recycled it, then loaded my .udf -- hopefully no more problems. That new firmware and my .udf just hate each other for some reason...but I digress)! The point is, I wasn't able to play around with the mini-Bud project today as I had hoped.

I will have less than ideal weather conditions for the next few days, so it's a great chance for me to try for those stations I can get most of the time on this dish setup. I had a few requests, so I wanted to see what things you'd like me to post over the next few days (I'll be rather busy, but it is a hobby after all!)....

From Anole: "When you're done, would you consider a more concise list, just showing channels you can get 24/7?
The others are encouraging, but not worth getting out of bed for.
Also, I found it hard to follow which signals had a lot of operating margin, and which we're on the ragged edge.
The threshold of the receiver wasn't listed, and besides it varies for each type of signal."

I'm still wet behind the ears with this hobby, so I don't really know what you mean by operating margin vs. ragged edge (do you mean EIRP according to SatBeams)? By threshold, do you mean what Quality percentage I have to get before I get a picture? If so, you're right, it varies according to the transponder I'm on. CW comes in with almost no Q, others, like Legacy, needs a pretty high Q before I get no pixelation and a good lock.

From skyscanner4ever: "wow! nice! i too have the micro hd and I have a 1.2 meter dish and have been thinking of buying a c band lnb and swapping it out and occasionally going back and forth between c and ku, i am not gonna do the combo crap because the bsc combo never worked good for me as i would either get good on one or another. I was wondering if you could possibly get any of the nfl feeds and games on c band with your setup?"

As Iceberg mentioned, I don't think that's possible. I can't even get most of the C-band channels mentioned, but I was able to pick up a soccer game feed from Mexico on Satmex 6. I'll let you know if I catch anything.

So, idea #1: Receiver comparison. I want to hook up the microHD and the Openbox s10 for a comparison (and maybe the DVB-S only Traxis 3500 just for fun). Any special requests about what to include in the comparisons? Just channel names and Freq/polarity/SR for each Transponder? Quality on each receiver (I know that's really apples to oranges)?

Idea #2: per Anole's request, the "24/7" channels. I'll be looking for the stations I got last time, and the ones I can get this time. I'll be looking for a constant strong signal each day from each station. In addition to the frequencies, SR, polarity, and channel name, what else should I include? PIDs? FEC? Modulation? Video Resolution? Signal Quality? (I won't post the frequencies of wild feeds, but I'll be glad to mention a feed when I find it on the satellite, to maybe shed light on skyscanner4ever's question).

Taking requests

 

[joeroscoe1957]

Very interested in hearing about all watchable ch's you can pull in from sat's besides 99w & 91w . Thanks for posting small bud results .

 

[avenger]

Glad to to know that you are having a very good reception of most satellite channels that you have tried to receive.

You mentioned the equipment that you are using. Could you explain the depth of the of the lnb into the scalar ring, and the final skew of the lnb

I just got a scalar ring and a lnb holder from stogie5150 and would like to see if these parts will produce some channels.

I looked at all your picture, but do not know if you showed your final configuration as of placement of the lnb in the holder, the final skew, and final depth of lnb into the scalar ring.

Thank You.

 

[northgeorgia]

The best I can describe it is as follows: put the lnbf as far back in the holder as possible away from the dish, put the scalar as close as the edge as possible on the end of the lnbf, make sure the inner pins (take off the cover of the lnb) line up almost perfectly with the middle of where the lnb holder comes together (90 degree angle). I have a motorized setup for Ku-band, and have basically let the motor find the skew. In my experience it isn't far off what it should be on Ku-band for C-band. So if you have a stationary dish, just set the skew the same as you would for Ku-band. Unfortunately, you do have to play with it a bit, as these are just estimations, and usually you need to mark the dish's elevation for Ku-band because for C-band the dish does tend to need adjusting ever so slightly upward to compensate for the "look" of the lnbf. After you try a preliminary set-up, take some photos and let me know what you are getting and I'll see what other suggestions I can make

My current setup isn't right, but that was almost intentional. All I did was change out the Ku-band lnb and holder with my C-band lnbf, scalar and holder with no adjusting of the position of the scalar or lnbf, no tweaking the skew, and no moving the elevation around. I also knew extremely heavy storms were approaching, (not to mention the sun-cycle satellite outages later this week) so Ku-band would be flickering off and on the next few days due to rain fade -- a good time for hypothesizing: what could I get on a mini-Bud in a worse case scenario?

Well, not very much! My two-day experiment did surprise me, as only a handful of signals faded away completely by rain fade. Others pixelated or cut out, but surprisingly stayed on the air. I even caught a wild feed of a swearing in of a government official in the Yucatan peninsula during moderate rainfall today. The most reliable channels have been: 91W DMX mux 3927 V 7249; 99W Puerto Rico/Virgin Island network mux 3848 H 15029; 101W Gods Learning Channel 3710 V 4340; 113W Channel C7 Jalisco 3857 H 2800. Yesterday, before the wind and rain really messed up the atmosphere (and probably knocked the dish about some, too): LESEA at 60% reliability, CW mux had an 80% reliability, and there was heavy pixelation or no picture on GDMX mux, Legacy TV, TBN mux (125W) and Azteca NE Mexico mux (113W). I also had a few glimpses of two or three other Mexican channels on 113W, a scan but no picture on Golden Eagle (101W), and a few other scrambled channels. These additional channels were available yesterday, but couldn't be seen in today's tornado watch weather.

As I said, this is a careless setup in very extreme weather conditions just "for the fun of it." In fact, my father's Dish Network's signal was gone from last night until this evening due to the rain fade and tree branches swishing around. If I can manage to walk in something other than mud tomorrow, I'll try to see what adjustments I can make to peak the signal. I was curious to see how rain fade would affect C-band on a miniBUD. There is still quite a substantial effect, as expected. Hopefully, I can continue with the real experiments: 24/7 stations in a peaked setup under calm and clear conditions; and a competition for blind scanning and manually entered C-band stations between the microHD and Openbox s10.

But it may have to wait for better skies and when I'm less busy with work

Glad to to know that you are having a very good reception of most satellite channels that you have tried to receive.

You mentioned the equipment that you are using. Could you explain the depth of the of the lnb into the scalar ring, and the final skew of the lnb

I just got a scalar ring and a lnb holder from stogie5150 and would like to see if these parts will produce some channels.

I looked at all your picture, but do not know if you showed your final configuration as of placement of the lnb in the holder, the final skew, and final depth of lnb into the scalar ring.

Thank You.

 

[northgeorgia]

MiniBUD results from last week

View attachment cband247.xls

The attached Excel file gives some preliminary results for the 24/7 miniBUD channels. Keep in mind that I have received lots more channels than the ones posted here (including NHK), but these are the ones that came in during what I like to call "satellite hell week!" These are the results during a week of sun outages, huge thunderstorms, and a less-than-perfectly peaked system. Perfect for seeing what signals are reliable! Obviously, location plays a factor in this project, so what I can receive here in north Georgia may not be what you can receive elsewhere! I've returned the dish to its normal Ku-band operation for now, but in future experiments, I'll update the 24/7 list (hopefully, it'll be a more accurate reflection of what can be regularly received) and also try to do a receiver comparison on the miniBUD.

 

[joeroscoe1957]

Nice list , very well done , Thanks .

 

[climy]

My 6 ft Andrews is pulling in 107.3W unencrypted C-band HD MUX S/N 60. I got some time today and attached a Ku Lnbf bracket. It's 6 degrees apart getting a few Ku channels on 101W. The TPC HD and BVN S/N is 58. It's a stationary set up with C-band Lnb in the middle. Once, I moved the C-band to 103W and got DW very good in the morning. I also got ION HD. Today I'm trying to set a second Ku LNBF ten degrees apart from 107.3W and get 97W.

 

[Kraven]

@ NorthG: Still using the mini-bud? If so, how's the performance noawdays?

Cheers, K

 

[northgeorgia]

Well, I tried it a week or so ago, but as it was getting dark and I wanted Ku band for some other programming, I didn't have time to adjust it as much as I'd like. The other problem is that I had just relocated my dish and as it's on a board and bricks, the ground hadn't got quite settled yet (I want ALL my PBS on 125W Ku-band, so I kept tweaking until I got Oklahoma at 75%...grrr), so between the rain and cold and that incident, I haven't felt motivated to try it again recently.

That being said, I did get the GDMX mux (which is usually a bit difficult for me), and for the first time got Tele Amazonas out of Ecuador on 55.5W (but heavily pixelated with 25-30% Q). Also of note, back in late November, I scanned in WAPA America on 99W, RTN from Nayarit, Mexico on 113W, and TV Sinal, Rede Mercosul and TV Alvorada on 55.5W. So if my running DX total count is correct, my total channels (scrambled and ITC) received are:
TV: 155
Radio: 76
Wildfeeds: 8

Not bad for a 90 cm dish and scalar! (I did try without the conical scalar briefly to see what difference it made. At least in my case, not using the conical scalar resulted in no reception).

My dish is perfectly on the arc for Ku-band right now, tracking 30W to 125W with no problem. However, I can never leave it alone. Once the weather cooperates, I'm sure I'll be out there trying it again

 

[Kraven]

90CM... not bad! I thought you had a 1.2m dish.

Cheers, K

 

[wallyhts]

I agree that's very good results on a 90cm.

 

[northgeorgia]

Yes, as said elsewhere, not a true mini-Bud, but something else. Maybe a mini-mini-Bud

 

[SatelliteAV]

I think we have previously referred to a 90cm C-band dish as a micro-BUD.

 

[Martyn]

Climy,

I haven't tried a mini-BUD set up yet, but aren't you meant to be using a conical scalar ring on an offset dish?

Have you tried and is there any difference in signal? Your picture appears to show a standard scalar.

Martyn

 

[northgeorgia]

Problem with the "Micro-BUD" name is that I have seen some experiments online where people tried with 75 cm dishes! Maybe anything under 90 cm should be called, "Mission Impossible BUD"

 

[avenger]

Problem with the "Micro-BUD" name is that I have seen some experiments online where people tried with 75 cm dishes! Maybe anything under 90 cm should be called, "Mission Impossible BUD"

What would be the minimal dish size for a good reliable working Mini-Bud....What satellites would be the best and prefered ones to receive with this kind of size of dish.

 

[toucan-man]

10'. Point it at anything you like.

 

[coinmaster32]

What would be the minimal dish size for a good reliable working Mini-Bud....What satellites would be the best and prefered ones to receive with this kind of size of dish.

The smallest commercialy made dish I have ever seen was 5 feet wide. Most were sold by radioshack for satellite TV off one satellite.

With that said, several years ago I made a mini bud from an old primestar oval dish. (Not the larger round ones).

I was able to pull in a little c-band with it.

For a mini-bud, I think 4 feet would work ok, but don't expect to get everything.

 

[primestar31]

The smallest commercialy made dish I have ever seen was 5 feet wide. Most were sold by radioshack for satellite TV off one satellite.

With that said, several years ago I made a mini bud from an old primestar oval dish. (Not the larger round ones).

I was able to pull in a little c-band with it.

For a mini-bud, I think 4 feet would work ok, but don't expect to get everything.

I remember 4 foot ring-mount dishes in the '80's. My first c-band dish was in 1983, and was a spun aluminum 6 foot Danex dish. It was on a polar mount, and had a threaded-rod handscrew actuator to move from sat to sat. Sats were 4 degrees apart back then, and it worked very well.

One of the biggest mistakes I ever made, was leaving the dish there when we moved in 1989. It was already gone when I went back to check a few years later.