HDDVD vs BluRay Round one

vurbano

On Double Secret Probation
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http://www.highdefdigest.com/feature_blu-ray_vs_hd_dvd_round_one.html

Blu-ray vs. HD DVD: Round One

By Peter M. Bracke
Monday July 3, 2006 at 12:45AM EST

As I sit down to write my initial comparisons of the first-generation of Blu-ray and HD DVD hardware and software, it's hard to believe that after two-odd years of hype, hope and expectation, both formats have finally launched and are now only as far away as a quick stroll to your local Best Buy. With all the obstacles that have been thrown in front of both formats -- the numerous product delays, persistent naysaying by the mainstream media and much industry catfighting -- even the most optimistic home theater enthusiast could be forgiven for thinking this day would never come. But now that the dust has settled, and Blu-ray and HD DVD are at last real-world consumer products, we can take a step back, assess each format's initial strength and weaknesses, and gaze into our crystal ball to predict what the future may hold for the future of prerecorded, high-definition disc-based content.

Having lived with the first of the two high-def formats, HD DVD, for over two months now -- and after having reviewed nearly three dozen HD DVD discs -- I can safely say that it has delivered on the bottom line: producing generally excellent image and audio quality, and at least matching the amount of extras currently being offered on standard DVD. Which is to say that if the format hasn't exactly thrown down the gauntlet for Blu-ray, it at least set a bar that its rival had to match, or risk being perceived as a second place finisher.

What follows are, in no particular order, my impressions of the positives and negatives of the Blu-ray format thus far -- and how it stacks up to HD DVD. I'll also address some of the technical issues that have plagued first-generation hardware and software for both formats, and I'll save my declaration of which format I feel has "won" this first round one battle until the very end of this overview (gotta build some suspense, right?). I want to emphasize that this is only the first of many comparisons to come, and initial impressions are only just that.
Blu-ray's First Player -- General Ergonomics
Though many expected primary Blu-ray backer Sony to be the first out of the gate with a commercial Blu-ray player, extensive delays ended up pushing back the company's debut deck until later this fall. So it was left to Samsung, with their BD-P1000 Blu-ray wonder, to fly in like Superman and come to the rescue.

A bit more attractive in its design than either of the Toshiba HD DVD decks (the HD-A1 and its pricier cousin the HD-XA1), Samsung's BD-P1000 is a sleek and streamlined unit that boasts one immediately noticeable improvement over its HD DVD competitors: load times are quicker right out of the box, with start up taking roughly 25-odd seconds, then another 20 or so seconds to boot a disc. Compared to the Toshibas -- which can take well over a minute to fire up a disc -- the Samsung deck seems like something out of 'Star Trek' (in fairness to Toshiba, they now offer a free firmware upgrade for both of its HD DVD first-gen models, which greatly reduces load times and brings them more or less in line with ).

The BD-P1000 also trumps both of Toshiba's players in another area -- the remote. Neither of the controllers for the HD-A1 and HD-XA1 have won many fans amongst early adopters. Long and narrow, with tiny buttons and a frustrating layout, it is hard to imagine Samsung coming up with a more uncomfortable remote. And while the BD-P1000's controller is not the greatest remote I've ever used -- nor is it the prettiest -- it is easier to use, with larger buttons and a more intuitive arrangement. So, in terms of overall ergonomics of the first-gen players, round one goes to Samsung and Blu-ray.

Picture Quality, Part 1 -- Or, the Great "1080p versus 1080i" Debate
Ultimately, it doesn't matter how good a player looks on the outside if its guts on the inside can't deliver great video performance. Here is where the Samsung BD-P1000 really surprised many early adopters -- it has a number of problematic issues that certainly keep it from being a home run, or even a solid triple.

Perhaps the feature of the BD-P1000 that was most lauded before release was its ability to output true native 1080p resolution via the deck's HDMI output. However, it turns out that that claim comes with one very serious footnote. Seems the BD-P1000 can indeed output 1080p -- it is the "native" part that is up for debate. Though all current Blu-ray and HD DVD titles from supporting studios are known to include 1080p-encoded video transfers, the BD-P1000 pulls the video off the disc at 1080i, then de-interlaces it to 1080p internally before outputting via HDMI. Which is exactly the same process a 1080p-capable HDTV monitor uses when it is fed a 1080i signal and then upconverts it via its own circuitry to 1080p. So, if the Samsung is simply converting 1080i to 1080p internally instead of outputting 1080i and letting an HDTV upconvert it, is it really "native"? And more importantly, is the image quality any better?

Having reviewed 11 Blu-ray disc releases thus far, my impression is that, no, the 1080p output on the Samsung offers no appreciable upgrade in quality over the 1080i output on either of the Toshibas. In fact, depending on which HDTV you own, your monitor may end up doing a better job of de-interlacing a 1080i signal than the Samsung.

Picture Quality, Part 2 -- Or, the Great "HDMI versus Component" Debate
The "native 1080p versus de-interlaced 1080i" conundrum aside, what has been generating the biggest negative buzz for Blu-ray and the Samsung BD-P1000 are reports that some users have experienced a degradation in picture quality when viewing discs via the deck's HDMI output. The story first generated attention over at The Digital Bits, where editor Bill Hunt wrote this very fine piece on some comparative testing he did between the picture quality generated by the Samsung's HDMI versus component outputs. The surprising outcome? The BD-P1000's component outputs performed far more impressively, with the HDMI output suffering from decreased resolution and weaker color reproduction. While this problem appears to be particular to Panasonic HDTV monitors and not other brands of HDTVs, it is clearly a problem, since the industry is championing HDMI as being the connector of the choice for high-def content.

When assessing the transfer of any Blu-ray or HD DVD disc title, we here at High Def Digest always compare the HDMI versus component output on every disc to detect any depreciable differences in image quality, as well as to confirm whether or not the Image Constraint Token (ICT) has been activated on a particular disc title or not (which would down-convert the component output's resolution to standard DVD quality). So far, we have not experienced any noticeable degradation of the image quality via the Samsung's HDMI versus component output on any of the Blu-ray titles we have reviewed, but we are not currently using any Panasonic brand HDTVs.

Instead, the image quality issues we have encountered with the Blu-ray discs we have reviewed thus far (most notably Sony's initial launch titles) have stemmed from weak and inconsistent source material. The soft, drab and dirty prints used for such titles as 'The Fifth Element,' 'xXx' and 'House of Flying Daggers' were disappointing, and regardless of which output you choose, they don't look particularly good. This is in marked contrast to Warner and Universal's HD DVD titles, which, aside from the occasional dud (such as the poor 'Full Metal Jacket') have more consistently delivered strong transfers. Lionsgate's initial Blu-ray offerings, too, have suffered. All eight of the studio's first batch of discs have been marred by an inexplicable "dropped frames" problem, in which there is a visible jittering of the image during scenes with fast-moving action.

While no one expected either HD DVD or Blu-ray to arrive without a single hitch, due to the severity of the problems that have plagued Blu-ray thus far, overall, HD DVD has delivered the more consistently impressive and durable initial product.
Audio Quality
Boy, the Blu-ray and HD DVD camps certainly don't make this one easy. With the content providers for each format all using different audio encoding formats for their discs, trying to level the playing field for a fair comparison is like trying to compare apples and oranges and bananas. HD DVD backers Warner and Universal have so far favored Dolby Digital-Plus tracks (and the occasional full-blown TrueHD mix), while Sony has decided to go with uncompressed PCM 5.1 soundtracks on its initial Blu-ray releases and Lionsgate is simply porting over the the existing Dolby Digital EX and DTS-ES mixes from its standard DVD counterparts).

And while Blu-ray has certainly been far more consistent in delivering solid audio than video, I've been generally pleased with the audio quality of the HD DVD releases as well. Bottom line: until a studio comes out with a title on both Blu-ray and HD DVD that includes the same audio formats on both releases, I have to call this one a wash for now.

Exclusive HD Content -- Say Hello to the "Blu-Wizard"
Though supporting studios all have different names for the technology, all current Blu-ray and HD DVD discs offer the ability to seamlessly navigate a disc's menus in real-time, with no interruption to the playback of the main feature. So far, Warner and HD DVD are the only ones to go the extra mile by offering more streamlined menus, the ability to customize your own chapter bookmarks, and even zoom-and-pan the picture at up to 32x magnification on their HD DVD discs.

As for actual exclusive HD bonus content you can't get on a standard DVD release, currently HD DVD gets my vote. Two titles have been released so far (Warner's 'Constantine' and Universal's 'Bourne Supremacy') that include the "In-Movie Experience" -- the presentation of bonus materials like filmmaker interviews and behind-the-scenes footage in a video commentary-like format, all seamlessly integrated with playback of the main feature. Certainly, a couple of titles is hardly a deluge, but at least it's a start.

Meanwhile Sony backer Blu-ray is touting something called "Blu-Wizard" in its Blu-ray sales material. Though no discs have yet been released with the function, it promises to allow users to create their own "custom playlists" of scenes and bonus content, as well as watch supplements interactively as pop-up overlays atop playback of the main feature. Sounds pretty cool, and a bit more interactive than Warner's "In-Movie Experience" (which does not allow viewers to create supplement playlists).

Studio Support
Technically, Blu-ray has the edge here -- more studios overall have pledged support for the format than HD DVD. However, as of this writing, in terms of the number of studios actively producting titles, both HD DVD and Blu-ray enjoy somewhat equal support -- Universal and Warner on the HD DVD side, and Sony/MGM and Lionsgate on the Blu-ray side. And with HD DVD generally earning more positive notices than Blu-ray, if consumer sales for HD DVD follow suit, so too could studio support.

Packaging -- Ain't Blu Pretty?
Well, at least they're consistent. Unlike the myriad of packaging options that hampered DVD when it first debuted (anyone remember that atrocious "Polygram-pak," which required you to slide the disc out of the box on this little tray that scratched the hell out of the disc before you even played it?) both the HD DVD and Blu-ray packages are virtually identical in shape, thickness and weight. Of course, there is one big difference -- color. Now I realize this is entirely subjective, but I slightly prefer the vivid deep blue of the Blu-ray packaging, not only because it is more serene but also because it allows for graphics on the reverse side of the front and back cover to show through the inside of the packaging. Kinda nifty.

Durability -- Hard Coat is Cool
Perhaps the least-heralded aspect of the Blu-ray format is the implementation of Sony's "Hard Coat" technology to protect the discs from damage. Anyone who has ever rented a DVD from Netflix only to find it scratched and unplayable knows how frustrating and commonplace wear and tear can be. So Sony created a special polymer protective coating applied to every Blu-ray disc that helps prevent or greatly reduce skipping, pixilated images and other picture ailments that result from scratches and smudges.

Though I have yet to throw a few of my discs down and stomp on them to see which format takes the beating the best, perhaps someone will do a demolition derby comparison between the two formats soon. Hey, Consumer Reports, how 'bout it?

Money Still Talks
I said it in my earlier HD DVD First Impressions editorial, and I think it's just as true now that Blu-ray has arrived -- the deciding factor in the high-def format battle will ultimately be affordability, pure and simple. Early adopters and those with disposable income aside, the "average joe" consumer doesn't have thousands of dollars to invest in untested formats, and home entertainment is just one small facet of their busy lives. In order for HD DVD and Blu-ray to succeed, both formats must eventually come down in price for both hardware and software. Way down.

Out of the gate, HD DVD wins the budget battle easily. With Toshiba's HD-A1 half the price of the Samsung BD-P1000's $999 price tag, that's a huge savings for a format that so far is consistently delivering better image quality and more bonus features. HD DVD discs on average also cost less per disc than Blu-ray (Lionsgate's premium $39.95 price tag for discs with no extras is particularly off-putting). Of course, we are still way early in the game, but it is not hard to imagine the initial sticker-shock an average consumer would experience when confronted with that $999 price tag for a Blu-ray player at their local Circuit City.

The PS3 Factor
If some industry analysts are to be believed, the high-def format war was won the minute Sony decided to include a Blu-ray drive in the PS3. Due out in November, if Sony is able to move the millions of units of the console that are expected, the number of households with a Blu-ray player will dwarf even the most optimistic sales projections for HD DVD (Microsoft's planned Xbox 360 HD DVD add-on be damned).

But here is where that ugly reality of cost again muddies the prognosis for Blu-ray. When Sony announced last month that it would be pricing its two launch versions of the PS3 at $499 and $599 (the latter including a larger hard drive and an HDMI output), the backlash from the gaming community was immediate. Easily one of the most expensive next-generation consoles ever introduced, diehard gamers will undoubtedly still plunk down the cash for a system they can't live without, but for the Blu-ray format to ultimately succeed it must become a mainstream consumer product. How are those high price tags for the PS3 going to affect long-term sales? Can the PS3, and by extension Blu-ray, cross-over as a must-have toy for middle-class families when it costs at least half a grand?

Suddenly, PS3 as Blu-ray's ace in the hole doesn't seem so assured. Certainly, the PS3 will play a major role in the format battle's next few years -- but I, for one, am no longer betting on Blu-ray's victory just on the strength of the PS3 factor alone.

Final Thoughts -- Nobody Puts Blu-ray in a Corner
So, the big question -- who won round one? I can't say either has sailed through their launch with flying colors. But all aspects considered -- reliability of hardware, video and audio quality of the discs released thus far, overall value for money -- I have to give HD DVD props for defying almost all predictions and trumping Blu-ray right at the starting line. For all of the Blu-ray camp's boasting of superior storage capability, increased interactivity and more across-the-board industry support, it just hasn't amounted to an appreciably better real-world product. In fact, Blu-ray has thus far underperformed.

Needless to say, this could all change. The fourth quarter will be the first true test for Blu-ray and HD DVD, with more studios releasing titles for both formats (most notably Fox for Blu-ray, and New Line for HD DVD), some second-generation hardware that should improve performance, and more new HDTVs that accept genuine native 1080p inputs. Once the playing field has been leveled and studios and manufacturers have had more time to surmount the learning curve, I bet we will see far more consistent product, and even a few cutting-edge discs that will blow everyone away.

In the meantime, if you're still on the fence in deciding between Blu-ray or HD DVD, there is nothing wrong with simply waiting it out a bit. As much fun as any new home electronics technology can be, it does come at a price -- but that is why High Def Digest is here. We do all the expensive heavy lifting for you, so when you're finally ready to jump in, you can buy with confidence. So continue to watch this space for daily news coverage and reviews, and see you in the fourth quarter with my impressions on round two of the great high-def DVD format war.
 
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Vurbano. I believe you actually found something pretty close to "definitive" now. :)

But, I think its a mistake this early in the game to talk in terms of "Blu-ray vs HD-DVD" because its really just "HD-A1 vs BD-P1000."

Waiting 6-12mo to assess the formats I think is more appropriate. By that time, all the big names will have their units out and we'll be able to see what's problems are inherent to the format and what are a result of an OEMs poor implementation of the technology.
 
colebert said:
Vurbano. I believe you actually found something pretty close to "definitive" now. :)

But, I think its a mistake this early in the game to talk in terms of "Blu-ray vs HD-DVD" because its really just "HD-A1 vs BD-P1000."

Waiting 6-12mo to assess the formats I think is more appropriate. By that time, all the big names will have their units out and we'll be able to see what's problems are inherent to the format and what are a result of an OEMs poor implementation of the technology.

Thats funny, I posted it as bait for you. This is an example of junk IMO.The author fails to hit home hard enough the ONLY important point in this war. The ONLY reason to buy either format is PQ. And at this point in time Blu RAY doesnt have it. Infact, most of the article is candy coated fluff, i.e.,PS3, packaging, etc. who cares. And that crap about nobody backing Blu Ray into a corner? Oh please. From what I see he totally misses the reason Blu Ray is failing on the PQ front. NO 50 GB media, no VC-1! He blames Blu Rays failure on the studios doing poor transfers. What a clueless idiot.:rolleyes:
 
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I am not going to buy any kind of hd dvd player untill they figure which one they are going to settle on. I got lucky with the vcr vs betamax buy buying a panasonic vcr back in 1981 for 650.00. Lasted me years. I don't feel like paying that much for a dvd player when I already have an upconverting dvd player now.

I really will be interested when they come out with a dvd recorder in the accepted format of course. I think I read somewhere, that Samsung will be coming out with an hd dvd player that does BOTH formats. Then it will be a matter of pricing.
 
vurbano said:
Thats funny, I posted it as bait for you. This is an example of junk IMO.The author fails to hit home hard enough the ONLY important point in this war. The ONLY reason to buy either format is PQ. And at this point in time Blu RAY doesnt have it. Infact, most of the article is candy coated fluff, i.e.,PS3, packaging, etc. who cares. And that crap about nobody backing Blu Ray into a corner? Oh please. From what I see he totally misses the reason Blu Ray is failing on the PQ front. NO 50 GB media, no VC-1! He blames Blu Rays failure on the studios doing poor transfers. What a clueless idiot.:rolleyes:


Huh? PQ is one factor. It might be your only reason to buy, but if jaw-jacking about "best PQ" was the end-all-be-all, my 80s and 90s would have been spent watching BetaMax videos.
 
PQ is the only reason to buy HD. And to spend an additional 500 bucks on BD and not get as good or better PQ than HD DVD is absurd. BD problems are not that its not the "best". Its problem is that is has many of the same video problems that HD over satellite has, macroblocking, pixelation, dropped frames, etc. and that is UNACCEPTABLE.
 
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I think that the whole thing about the Blu Ray was that you could compress more data on the disk than on the HD dvd. I don't think that they ever said that it would involve better pq. But I agree that pq would be the most important thing that you would want if you watch hd television. Kind of like standard stand alone Tivos compared to say a Dish or Directv dvr receiver. You could record more to the hard drive with the Tivo using the worst pq setting but would you want to watch it? The sat dvrs look as good as when it was first aired. The hard drive is set amount and the only thing that changes the recording time is the mpeg 2 shows vs the mpeg 4 shows , but the sat dvrs pq look much better than Tivos. THat is why I sold my Tivo and just stayed with Dish hd dvrs. Pq is the most important thing I want in tv -either dvd or dvr or ota.
 
Still waiting for prices to come down and second generation players or a combined player. I am reluctant to invest on either format right now. HD DVD looks like a no brainer for anyone who wants to have it now. I would not touch Blu Ray at all --- it is idiotic to do so.
 
Sean Mota said:
Still waiting for prices to come down and second generation players or a combined player. I am reluctant to invest on either format right now. HD DVD looks like a no brainer for anyone who wants to have it now. I would not touch Blu Ray at all --- it is idiotic to do so.

Yeah, what Sean said. Actually, it isn't about the comparative picture quality at all. They are both acceptable and the bugs will be worked out. It's about titles. I bought Lasrerdisc on the first day it went into test market in Denver (for $787!). I then spent the next six months sorting through boxes of mixed discs, trying to find ANYTHING I didn't already own. Not going to happen again. I will look seriously when either format hits 1000 released titles.
 
Perhaps the clueless idiot simply has a different opinion than you. And he seems to be earning money doing this kind of work.

As the article states, the 4th quarter will tell. By then, prices should be coming down, although I expect the biggest drops to be in 2007. Improved speeds and features should be available. And more titles will be out. Maybe the dual layer BD will make an appearance. If HD-DVD has better PQ thru the first year of introduction, maybe they'll trump BD. But does anyone objectively really expect that to happen? I daresay there won't be much PQ difference by year's end. The race has just begun, place your bets, but it's too early to declare a winner.

Sure, if I had to buy today, I'd go with HD-DVD. But I won't buy today. Maybe by year's end, probably next year. I'd like to see better performing, less expensive players and have more confidence in who's going to be around for the long run. I'm relieved I didn't buy LaserDisc.

Thank you for the article. Even though you don't think highly of it, it was informative.
 
teamerickson said:
I think VC-1 has about three times the compression than MPEG2. It's more efficient.


What I meant is that they can hold more on the disk with blue ray vs hd dvd and in order to do this I would think that they would have more compression . I don't know for sure how they do it but they do have the capablility to hold more on the same disk than hd dvds do.
 
One of the major causes of current Blu Ray PQ problems:

Originally Posted by Kris Deering
While I am really interested in Amir's take on these titles, I wish he had a different player to evaluate with. The Samsung doesn't do a non-processed 1080P output. The broadcom chip is only outputting up to 1080i. It is using the new Genesis FLI chip to do 1080P out, and frankly I am not that impressed with the new Faroudja processing. It is doing chroma filtering despite the fact that the Broadcom chip does not have CUE issues and it won't even let 1080i go through unprocessed. If it at least did that then I could use another true 1080i de-interlacing solution that didn't filter. I am hoping that the Sony or Pioneer player won't have this issue, but this alone would prevent me from buying the Samsung. It would be almost impossible to say if the issues you were seeing were from the software or player (unless of course you could verify that the VAIO didn't have any video processing being done and output from that to compare the issues, but I guess that won't be until later).

Perhaps the Blu Ray players should just output 1080i and let the TV's do the corrct upconversion.
 
vurbano said:
Perhaps the Blu Ray players should just output 1080i and let the TV's do the corrct upconversion.

I vote for that, on both Blu-Ray & HD-DVD. I think BD only specified 1080p output for their adverstising slogan "True High Definition". I would expect a 1080p HDTV set costing $3k-$4k & higher to do a better job of deinterlacing that 1080i signal and converting it to 1080p than an HD DVD player costing $500. Even more so than the Samsung BD players monkey rigging to output 1080p.

And remember the video content of both HD-DVD & BD is only 1080p 24 frames per second. And 1080p TV set still has to do some processing to convert it to 1080p 60 fps.
 
CochiseGuy said:
I vote for that, on both Blu-Ray & HD-DVD. I think BD only specified 1080p output for their adverstising slogan "True High Definition". I would expect a 1080p HDTV set costing $3k-$4k & higher to do a better job of deinterlacing that 1080i signal and converting it to 1080p than an HD DVD player costing $500. Even more so than the Samsung BD players monkey rigging to output 1080p.

And remember the video content of both HD-DVD & BD is only 1080p 24 frames per second. And 1080p TV set still has to do some processing to convert it to 1080p 60 fps.
From what Ive seen and heard from a professional calibrater every 1080p Samsung DLP correctly deinterlaces and constructs 1080p and the older 56" models can be had for 2k not 3k. And the HD-A1 just outputs 1080i not 1080p, I think Toshiba was smart in that regard. If Samsung and other BluRay player manfacturers were smart they would rip out the 1080i to 1080p chip, cut costs and problems and just output 1080i.
 
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vurbano said:
From what Ive seen and heard from a professional calibrater every 1080p Samsung DLP correctly deinterlaces and constructs 1080p and the older 56" models can be had for 2k not 3k. And the HD-A1 just outputs 1080i not 1080p, I think Toshiba was smart in that regard. If Samsung and other BluRay player manfacturers were smart they would rip out the 1080i to 1080p chip, cut costs and problems and just output 1080i.
They can't do that. 1080p is the big buzz word. That's why BD is better than, HD-DVD! Didn't you know that??? You need to spend some time talking to the BestBuy and CompUSA sales folk. They'll set you straight! :D

Seriously, tho. I have heard reports that the Samsung BD player works better with component than HDMI on certain TVs. I don't know much about that player, but there has to be a setting to just output 1080i instead of 1080p. If all this is true, then just doing that would fix the problems, right? I wonder if Sony will do better with their player, or if it's really just the disks.

-John
 
MikeD-C05 said:
What I meant is that they can hold more on the disk with blue ray vs hd dvd and in order to do this I would think that they would have more compression . I don't know for sure how they do it but they do have the capablility to hold more on the same disk than hd dvds do.
The data is closer to the surface. I think they can make the data smaller because it is closer. It has yet to be determined if any playback problems could occur with this. When they use better and more efficient codec, they will have an advantage. But currently, HD DVD can hold more than Blue ray (35gig vs 25gig). I guess in the future Blue ray may be better. But in the future, we're all dead! :D
 
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I have a hard time believing that anyone here considers Samsung's Blu-Ray DVD player a good comparison match for the Toshiba's HD-DVD player.. Samsung makes crappy DVD players! Why would anyone believe that they could make a decent Blu-Ray player when they have yet to make a decent DVD player? Why not wait till Sony brings out their Blu-Ray player and compare it to Toshiba's HD-DVD players? That, I believe would be a fairer comparison, mano a mano, the main dude against the other main dude. Let's see if Sony's Blu-Ray can do better.

I know, the Samsung's is out now. Why has Sony held their player back? Could it be that they wanted the HDMI 1.3 version on their player? Is the HDMI 1.3 that important? It is if you want true lossless audio out of your player. Of course you would have to have an A/V receiver that can receive and decode HDMI 1.3. They will not be out till this fall. Hummm, another reason for Sony's and every other main Blu-Ray DVD player manufacturer to hold back their Blu-Ray players?

As to the discs themselves, if Sony can get the dual Blu-Ray discs out and working I believe that their movies will look better. Anyone here remember the first DVD's produced? How everyone could't wait until the format matured? Anyone remember the first reviews to Toshiba's HD-DVD players? Most of those reviews said to wait!

The sky is not falling. Blu-Ray is not dead. This is a differant market than when Beta-Max and VHS went at it. Back then the market was extreemly small and only one format could survive. Now, the market is worldwide. Both formats could very well survive. Just like game developers make their products available on various platforms I believe that we will see movie studios producing movies for both formats. Don't be surprised if both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray are around years from now -- I won't be!:)
 
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A second thought, what if Sony sells 2 million PS3s by the end of the year? Anyone here think there will be that many HD-DVD players out there by the end of the year? I don't think so. Also, any word on when Pioneer and Denon will be bring out their HD-DVD players? Oh, sorry, I forgot, they are supporting Blu-Ray right now. Of course that could change at any minute and probably will!:D
 
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JoeSP, I agree we should wait for things to shake out before declaring one technology superior. The point I would have to make is based on what equipment you can currently evaluate in your local BB. HD DVD, IMO, has offered a better first impression. I directly compaired the two recently and found the PQ on the Toshiba HD DVD much better that the Samsung BR. The artifact on the BR was terrible! If Joe Public has even the slightest ability to discern varying levels of PQ he will say, "Damn, worse PG for more $$$" and that will hurt BR and be hard to overcome even as better hardware comes out.
 

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