EU investigating format war

[mike123abc]

Europe Steps Up Probe of New DVD Formats - WSJ.com

(yes it is a subscription link, but I am sure it will be found soon on non pay sites)

In a move that could be key to determining the future of home cinema, European antitrust regulators are stepping up their probe into possible anticompetitive practices in the format war over high-definition DVDs.

Hollywood's studios are racing to dig up files, emails and records of telephone conversations related to the competing Blu-ray and HD DVD formats after the European Commission sent out letters last month demanding evidence of their communications and agreements on the new generation of DVD formats.

The European Commission, the European Union's executive body, appears to be particularly interested in the activities of the Blu-ray group because of its dominance in Hollywood, according to people familiar with the situation. The commission is investigating whether improper tactics were used to suppress competition and persuade the studios to back their format.

 

[CochiseGuy]

Europe Steps Up Probe of New DVD Formats - WSJ.com

(yes it is a subscription link, but I am sure it will be found soon on non pay sites)

No, the link works OK.

And the EU investigation certainly got old Bill Hunt at The Digital Bits in a hissy fit yesterday -

And around the Net today, here's an indication of just how bitterly this high-def format war is being fought (and how desperate the HD-DVD camp is becoming in battling Blu-ray Disc). . . . . In other words, the HD-DVD camp can't seem to win this war based on consumer sales alone, even after slashing their hardware prices, so now they're trying other measures to try to force the many Blu-ray exclusive Hollywood studios to support their format too.

What all this means to you, is that Blu-ray is rapidly becoming the clear choice. In our opinion, there's just no chance that HD-DVD is going to win this format war, and the HD-DVD camp's increasingly desperate moves now should make that obvious to all. With Blu-ray hardware prices dropping, and with Fox and MGM about to start adding their catalog titles to the BD exclusive title slate of Disney, Sony, Lionsgate and now Anchor Bay/Starz (not to mention all the great BD titles coming from Warner and Paramount), if you've been thinking about getting into high-def discs, now's a great time to jump in with Blu-ray.


Not that I read his useless propaganda he disburses as "news".
Another forum I belong to posted the article and it incited a fierce debate.
But no, the EU investigation is not about trying to "force the many Blu-ray exclusive Hollywood studios to support their format too", it's about seeing if there was any unlawful collusion / coercion to get studios to favoring one means over another in delivering their content to consumers .

And I'm happy to see Bill Hunt has inside information that Fox / MGM is actually going to deliver on their promise of title releases. Unfortunately, I don't see any place to pre-order those titles yet.

 

[navychop]

What is "unlawful" in one country may be a standard business practice in another.

 

[mike123abc]

It will be interesting since they would end up being on the side of Microsoft, perhaps the most hated monopoly every by EU standards...

 

[Derwin0]

The EU can only look at distribution contracts for within the EU.
For contracts the studios have to distribute in the US, the EU has no authority.

 

[mike123abc]

The EU can only look at distribution contracts for within the EU.
For contracts the studios have to distribute in the US, the EU has no authority.

Yes, but if they somehow force studios to release in both BD and HD-DVD in EU, the resulting HD-DVD discs could be mail ordered back into the US...

 

[Derwin0]

Yes, but if they somehow force studios to release in both BD and HD-DVD in EU, the resulting HD-DVD discs could be mail ordered back into the US...

European discs generally cost a lot more than American. That would hardly make a dent in the market. Not to mention that BD region codes their discs.

 

[navychop]

Unfortunately, if a U.S. BD is released as HD DVD in Europe, the region coding is stripped, as HD DVD does not support, and never will support, regional coding.

No matter. This is a tempest in a teapot.

 

[Jamey K]

Not that I read his (Bill Hunt) useless propaganda he disburses as "news".

Bought and paid for. He is useless.

 

[JoeSp]

Maybe you guys should offer the original news source for this story - The Wall Street Journal:

Europe Steps Up Probe of New DVD Formats - WSJ.com


It is not Bill Hunt's news but that of the WSJ. You guys know about this news source don't you? Maybe if you would follow links to the original source you would better understand the issue.

It is pretty simply, HD-DVD is loosing and starting to loose big. The HD-DVD camp has already tried this move here in the states and the courts would not even hear the case. Now they go to Europe and hope that they can get a foothold there and force studios supporting BluRay to put their titles out on HD-DVD. This too will fail because you can not force an American company to do something they do not want to do and their own country will not force them to do. They can simply wait out the demise of HD-DVD (will probably happen early '08) and then they will not have to worry about the EU.

I guess you guys do not believe in the free market -- the idea that you have the right to buy the car you want, the house you want, go to the school of your choice, live the life you want. In the same matter a studio does not have the right to make the movies they want, with the stars they want, on the media they want?

To me this smacks of sociallistic and not free market enterprise. This is the only reason the EU is looking into this but they way they move (takes them years to gear up and come to a conclusion) this so-called format war will be over. The HD-DVD camp wants everyone to play fair and they call Sony cheaters and liars but it is M$ and Toshiba here who are not facing the music. I am sure they are not asking the EU to invetigate them for price fixing (dropping the price on their players already below profitablity to unattainable low prices and Universal's HD-DVD only releases and Warner and Paramounts uneven releases -- not supporting the same PQ or sound formts) of course -- just Sony's tactics.

Read the article from the WSJ and it is apparent that the trend is away from HD-DVD and towards BluRay. Articles like this in the respected WSJ does not paint HD-DVD in a good light. It makes the HD-DVD camp look like sore loosers. Sueing and trying to get goverments to see things your way is the last vestige of a company in a loosing battle. Anyone here remember Netscape and their demise?

Sony did not pull these tatics during the Beta-VHS wars. They lost (they did not have enough studio support nor enough storage space -- sound familar) and they pulled up stakes and started making VHS players (and some very nice ones). It is time for Toshiba to say goodbye to M$'s money and make the right decision. If droping prices on players and offering free movies and having HD-DVD supporting studios push up to 5 to 1 releases in a week does not even give them pairity with BluRay then its over.

If The Wall Street Journal makes a business statement can CEO's of major retailers be far behind with their decisions? The handwriting is on the wall for the HD-DVD camp and this EU investigation is the last gasp of a dying prayer. If the EU decides as the US courts have that the studios own their content and have the right to put it on whatever media they want then HD-DVD camp will join BETA as an also-ran -- probably alot sooner then any of us expected.

 

[teachsac]

Maybe you guys should offer the original news source for this story - The Wall Street Journal:

Europe Steps Up Probe of New DVD Formats - WSJ.com


It is not Bill Hunt's news but that of the WSJ. You guys know about this news source don't you? Maybe if you would follow links to the original source you would better understand the issue.

It is pretty simply, HD-DVD is loosing and starting to loose big. The HD-DVD camp has already tried this move here in the states and the courts would not even hear the case. Now they go to Europe and hope that they can get a foothold there and force studios supporting BluRay to put their titles out on HD-DVD. This too will fail because you can not force an American company to do something they do not want to do and their own country will not force them to do. They can simply wait out the demise of HD-DVD (will probably happen early '08) and then they will not have to worry about the EU.

I guess you guys do not believe in the free market -- the idea that you have the right to buy the car you want, the house you want, go to the school of your choice, live the life you want. In the same matter a studio does not have the right to make the movies they want, with the stars they want, on the media they want?

To me this smacks of sociallistic and not free market enterprise. This is the only reason the EU is looking into this but they way they move (takes them years to gear up) this so-called format war will be over. The fat lady's car is closer to the opera and she is looking over her music.

If The Wall Street Journal makes a business statement can CEO's of major retailers be far behind with their decisions? The handwritings on the wall for the HD-DVD camp and this EU investigation is the last gasp of a dying prayer. If the EU decides as the US courts have that the studios own their content and have the right to put it on whatever media they want then HD-DVD can join BETA as an also-ran.

I guess you forgot about the successful EU and individual U.S. states suits against Microsoft. While I don't necessarily agree with them, I did get a huge chunk of change back that paid for a computer 2 years ago. It wasn't the original article that everyone was responding to either. It was Bill's "spin".

S~

 

[JoeSp]

You miss a point here teachsac. The US courts decided this suite against M$ before the EU met and decided the same thing. The EU took their stance with the knowledge that the US courts were going to hold M$ to some responsiblity.

In this issue the HD-DVD camp has already lost its bid in the US courts. You are looking for the EU to come to a decision that is oposite of the decision of the US courts. I don't see that happening and even if they do they have no jurisdiction over a US company.

If the EU did decide that the HD-DVD camp request has merit the only way they could force a US company to do something that the US court system will not force them to do is file a lawsuit in the World Court. This would pit EU lawmakers against US lawmakers. Who do you think will win here? This is the US and our government is not going to allow another government to dictate to a US company how they can and can not do business. This is unheard of and has never happened in the history of this county.

This would start a legal battle over imports that would escalate to covering most everything any company in any country wanted to import. You really think the EU is ready to start this type of import war? Especially one they could not win? The only course for the EU if they decide in HD-DVD's favor is to censor sale of BluRay product in the EU. That would start an import war of another kind. Especially with the price fixing of Toshiba's players. Where is the suit by the BluRay camp on this issue -- something the courts would listen too?

Oh I forgot, this is the United States of America -- a land of free commerce where you can set your selling price at anything you want to except for undercutting the market or price gouging -- what?

 

[teachsac]

Not unprecedented. Ask Google, Apple, Universal Music Group, and EMI. Under articles 81 and 82 of the Treaty of Rome "Market sharing, exclusive marketing and other anti-competitive practices may be exempt from competition law if the behaviour increases consumer benefits or technical progress." Both camps would fall under this. As for Microsoft, The US court influenced the final EU decision as the EU copyright law was shot down for competition.

 

[JoeSp]

Not unprecedented. Ask Google, Apple, Universal Music Group, and EMI. Under articles 81 and 82 of the Treaty of Rome "Market sharing, exclusive marketing and other anti-competitive practices may be exempt from competition law if the behaviour increases consumer benefits or technical progress." Both camps would fall under this. As for Microsoft, The US court influenced the final EU decision as the EU copyright law was shot down for competition.

Where is the 'exclusive marketing' being provided by the BluRay group? You can buy movies in HD-DVD and purchase HD-DVD players. There is no monopoly either implied or actual in the high def movie distribution. Both camps distrubute movies in their respective formats and not in each others -- save for the 3 studios supporting both sides. If the EU decides to look into how the BluRay group signed up all those studios they would have to look at how and why M$ dollars are finding their way into Universal's and Toshiba's pockets.

I believe the WSJ article implied this as a no win situation for the HD-DVD group. Bottom line is it is not going to help HD-DVD in disc sales in the immediate timeframe. But the article in the WSJ just might push a few CEOs to lean their companies towards BluRay in an effort to shorten this war. Is the EU the going to take on BlockBuster, BestBuy, Sears, and any other retailer that decides to just do Blu in the future? I don't believe this is a can of worms the EU wants to open no matter what they say.

 

[mike123abc]

Well they may not be able to force HD-DVDs, but they could simply not allow the companies in question to do business in the EU. A very large market to be locked out of. But, of course this would take years and I doubt anything would come out of it since the war would probably be over by then.

 

[navychop]

Yep. Tempest in a teapot. Politicians posturing for voters- or is it pandering? Knowing full well it will all be for naught.