East Coast (NC) signal strength question DISH vs Directv

[dslate69]

I am in NC and used to have DISH and now have Directv. I have had a lot better signal and less rain fade with Directv.
I am now coveting the hopper \ joey setup at DISH but have loved the rock solid signal I have had since leaving DISH. I am not sure if I have trees in the distance that effects DISH and not Directv. Is DISH's SATs lower on the horizon for me? Has DISH added any new SAT positions higher on the horizon for more aiming options with recent SAT launches for me here in NC?
My DISH setup was the single dish with 3 or 4 lnbs about 5 years ago.
Thanks in advance

 

[CK SatGuy]

It's possible they could of moved your locals to another satellite. What's your exact location? (Just a zip code or city is fine.)

 

[dslate69]

27511 - Raleigh area
But I don't remember locals dropping more than other HD channels that were available at that time. That was and still is all I watch (HD). In fact now that I think of it my HD locals were on the special \diff LNB and seemed to hold up in the rain a little better. I couldn't swear to that though.

 

[Dah-Henny]

We have an excellent look at the eastern arc sats here in NC. I rarely lose signal. Click http://www.satelliteguys.us/thelist/index.php?page=subdish&sub=true to see what satellite Raleigh is on.

 

[dslate69]

I want to be clear. I am not saying Raleigh locals suffered from rain fade on DISH disproportionately to the other channels.
Is DISH lower in the sky for me for ALL the channels compared to Directv?

 

[dslate69]

Or maybe DISH SATs at that time were at half power. Just trying to see if DISH is now better for me than it was.
Thanks.

 

[Dah-Henny]

Dish's EA is higher in your sky than Direct.

 

[Dah-Henny]

With a Dish 1000.4ea, you're looking at 178.6 degrees magnetic.
With a Direct SL3, you're looking at 223.9 degrees magnetic.

 

[3HaloODST]

The reason people keep talking about locals is because depending on your location, you may be stuck with the Eastern Arc (61.5, 72.7, 77) or the Western Arc (110, 119, 129.) As for the location of Dish's satellites vs DirecTVs, they are in practically the same location. Dish WA is 110, 119, 129, DTV standard setup is 99, 101, 103 and depending on the location also 110 and 119. It looks like your location is eligible for either EA or WA depending on LOS and whether or not you have HD. Seeing as you are looking at the Hopper/Joey, you can use either arc. EA will be higher in elevation than WA for your location. So if you have a clear view of the southeast, you may be eligible for EA. If not, you may be able to find LOS to WA if the dish is peaked and/or location moved. You'll never know until you get an installer out.

Keep in mind that only WA has SD locals, if that matters to you, otherwise for your location EA and WA have the same locals.

Try to memorize or have the TP strength numbers from this Excel worksheet handy ( http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-forum/256056-list-minimum-average-thresholds.html ) for after the installer sets everything up, and make sure that your signal levels are adequate. If they are, then Dish can be just as (if not more compared to their KA sats) reliable as DirecTV.

 

[dslate69]

Ok, I appreciate all the help.
I had the 110, 119, 129 install several years ago. Still not certain anything has changed to make me think I will have a stronger signal (like new SATs with higher power). But I guess I won't know if I can get a strong signal without getting an installer out and the spreadsheet will help with that.
One more question. Does DISH have a 30 day cancellation policy if my signal does start dropping on me?

 

[Tampa8]

Several things.
1. It's fruitless to compare actual signal strength of Direct and Dish, they use totally different methods. In fact, Dish has a totally different reading now than they used to. Even readings between their Eastern Arc and Western Arc are different.
2. Your locals are on both the Western and the Eastern Arc. Your chances of a good signal is with the Eastern Arc unless you have a very good look at the 129 satellite. In Ct. that can be very hard to see, and in fact those locals in HD are only on the Eastern Arc. In Florida it isn't hard to see 129, and though Tampa locals are on both arcs, the Western Arc is actually now being used for new installs. With the new set-up of 61.5 and 72 only, the signal will be very good on the Eastern Arc for you. The downside is snow collects easier on an Eastern Arc Dish.
3. There is no trial period. However most techs will be sure you have a good signal before install. If they have to come back it might be them who absorbs the cost.

 

[3HaloODST]

According to TheList ( SatelliteGuys.US_TheList - Dish Network Raleigh, NC ,) his locals are available in HD on both EA and WA. I think that the EA will be the best bet for a new installation in that area, if one doesn't care about SD locals.

There is a 60-day period in which Dish will do everything within their abilities to make sure the signal is right. Your best best is to make sure the signal strength is comparable to what's on that spreadsheet I mentioned, particularly the averages for the area. Also make sure you're not pointed at trees that can potentially cause issues.

Basically don't sign anything, don't let the installer leave, until you either have a good signal strength with a good LOS, or you have canceled and told him to take the equipment with him (if you have to do the latter of course, don't sign anything.)

 

[Tampa8]

I think that the EA will be the best bet for a new installation in that area, if one doesn't care about SD locals.

I can't totally agree. If a good look at 129 there is a little less rain fade and almost no problems with snow collecting from the WA. I have both arcs.
The wild card is not having to aim at 77 also. That may raise the EA signal, lessen rain fade, just be left with more snow collecting. By the way - with WA in something like 13 years I can count maybe twice or three times snow collecting and blocking the signal, in about three years or so on the EA it's more often every winter, and several times in some single snow storms. On all those occasions except once last Winter the WA was clear of snow.

As for rain fade, Tampa and some other Florida installations went from EA to WA because of less rain fade, the difference there is much heavier rain on a regular sometimes daily afternoon basis than you see to the North. He may well see less times he loses a signal with the WA but he has to have a good look at 129.

 

[Teehar]

Eastern arc sats are higher elevation here in NC than dtv.Western arc is lower than dtv.That said I have had dtv the old 18" sd version and currently have both western arc and eastern arc dish antennas.There was/is virtually no difference in loss of signal with either of the 3.In other words if heavy thunder storms move through then chances are all 3 would lose signal at roughly the same time and the same amount of time.The only issue which is a minor one is the eastern arc dish being tilted up more tends to collect more of the wet snow than dtv or western arc.Unless you have LOS issues either arc should work in Raleigh.

 

[dbs2000]

The reason people keep talking about locals is because depending on your location, you may be stuck with the Eastern Arc (61.5, 72.7, 77) or the Western Arc (110, 119, 129.) As for the location of Dish's satellites vs DirecTVs, they are in practically the same location. Dish WA is 110, 119, 129, DTV standard setup is 99, 101, 103 and depending on the location also 110 and 119. It looks like your location is eligible for either EA or WA depending on LOS and whether or not you have HD. Seeing as you are looking at the Hopper/Joey, you can use either arc. EA will be higher in elevation than WA for your location. So if you have a clear view of the southeast, you may be eligible for EA. If not, you may be able to find LOS to WA if the dish is peaked and/or location moved. You'll never know until you get an installer out.

Keep in mind that only WA has SD locals, if that matters to you, otherwise for your location EA and WA have the same locals.

Try to memorize or have the TP strength numbers from this Excel worksheet handy ( http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-forum/256056-list-minimum-average-thresholds.html ) for after the installer sets everything up, and make sure that your signal levels are adequate. If they are, then Dish can be just as (if not more compared to their KA sats) reliable as DirecTV.

Now that you have mentioned something I wondered for a long time, why does E* uses transponders 14, 15, 16 & 21 as a "reference". Why those in particular. I would love to know.

 

[digiblur]

Several things.
1. It's fruitless to compare actual signal strength of Direct and Dish, they use totally different methods. In fact, Dish has a totally different reading now than they used to. Even readings between their Eastern Arc and Western Arc are different.
2. Your locals are on both the Western and the Eastern Arc. Your chances of a good signal is with the Eastern Arc unless you have a very good look at the 129 satellite. In Ct. that can be very hard to see, and in fact those locals in HD are only on the Eastern Arc. In Florida it isn't hard to see 129, and though Tampa locals are on both arcs, the Western Arc is actually now being used for new installs. With the new set-up of 61.5 and 72 only, the signal will be very good on the Eastern Arc for you. The downside is snow collects easier on an Eastern Arc Dish.
3. There is no trial period. However most techs will be sure you have a good signal before install. If they have to come back it might be them who absorbs the cost.

The signal calculation is the same between eastern arc and western arc.

 

[Tampa8]

The signal calculation is the same between eastern arc and western arc.

Notice I didn't say the calculations are different, only the readings are different. I get a higher reading for 119/110 than I can from 61.5/72 even being at the East Coast, both in Ct. and Florida.

 

[digiblur]

Notice I didn't say the calculations are different, only the readings are different. I get a higher reading for 119/110 than I can from 61.5/72 even being at the East Coast, both in Ct. and Florida.

That's the way I read it since you were saying dish and direct were different.

 

[harshness]

DISH's Ku signals should be better able to penetrate the atmosphere than DIRECTV's even though the DISH dish is much smaller.

Your DISH installer may not have been as diligent as the one provided by DIRECTV. Sometimes it comes down to luck of the draw.

 

[dbs2000]

Now that you have mentioned something I wondered for a long time, why does E* uses transponders 14, 15, 16 & 21 as a "reference". Why those in particular. I would love to know.

Anyone know why those four in particular.