Dish Change Question

Well something doesn't make sense, because I posed this question on Claude's dealer board & nobody there has seen &/or heard of it, either. (not sure if you are an independent dealer, or if your company is an RSP for DISH, but if you're the later, maybe that's why you guys are getting these LNBF's...)
AND...while I understand the subs on this board are a fraction of E* subs, not a single member here has mentioned getting one of these, that has been installed "for months now". Is it some deep, dark trade secret that prevents you from posting a simple pic of this???

FWIW, I also mentioned re: EA being retired & several techs responded that not only have they not heard a thing about this, but in fact, as recently as a week ago, they are STILL being sent work orders with EA dishes. Matter of fact one of the board admins is a larger dealer that installs in 2 different EA DMA's & has not heard a thing about it going away. And considering the couple of dealers that mentioned this are pretty up on E*'s procedures, I find it hard to believe they missed notices from E*.
We're an RSP for Dish and the only reason I haven't posted a picture is because I'm an area manager, not a tech, so I'm not out installing them, but if you insist, I will get you all a nice, clear picture today. IDGAD what retailers say. Retailers on the Heirarchy are at the bottom of the list. This isn't the old days. Retailers don't have metrics, don't have sales, and are a dying breed.
As for EA, I didn't say they were retiring it right now, I said as early as next spring.
ALL of our upgrade and service call workorders include arc swaps to Western Arc - other than the Davenport area and ALL of our New Connects call for WA lnb's. Your area has never been on EA.

Example of a TC today:

Equipment Required

LNB DPH WA Twin
Dish 500


Appointment
Troubleshoot Video
Set Up Dish
Existing Customer
Survey Site
Educate Customer
Setup Migration
Orbital Location
Remove 61.5 Orbital
Remove 72.7 Orbital
Set Up 110 Orbital
Set Up 119 Orbital


Also, I don't appreciate this insinuation that I'm just making things up
 
Retailers on the Heirarchy are at the bottom of the list...and are a dying breed.
Well honestly it's been that way pretty much IN the old days as well...so things really haven't changed in that respect :)

As for EA, I didn't say they were retiring it right now, I said as early as next spring.
I totally got that

Your area has never been on EA.
Very aware of that; FWIW that dealer I was speaking of, does installs in the southeast (FL, AL)

Also, I don't appreciate this insinuation that I'm just making things up
I apologize for inferring this...but I guess it's mind-numbing to me that E* is having you RSP's do things one way, but keeping retailers "in the dark" for what's eventually going to happen in the fairly near future. Having EA retire "as early as next spring" could be less than a calendar year & having even (the few) retailers putting in crap that's eventually going to have to be either swapped &/or repointed within that time frame, just seems completely - insane - to me. o_O

Look forward to the pics...
 
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It may well be that there aren't enough WA spot transponders available to co locate all of the EA only ones. Remember that there is a satellite being moved over to the 110 slot. That may relieve that issue. So, perhaps, Dish is doing this transformation slowly going by geography to get a head start on the inevitable.
 
Retailers on the Heirarchy are at the bottom of the list.
....and have been for years, which quickly becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That said however, how hard would it be to mention this to retailers on the Retailer Portal? We get emails from our rep weekly and this hasn't been mentioned ONCE.
Reminds me of my Viasat days when they would send emails that covered virtually nothing that was actually relevant to their dealers and NOT mention things that were absolutely vital, like the time they changed the keys and didn't say a word about it which caused literally thousands of tech hours to be lost the following days.
 
I am confused on what LNBs are called. Is the DPP version called LNBF? What is the hybrid version called?
LNB is a low noise block. LNBF is a low noise block feed. They are names for the same type of signal receiving apparatus, there is no distinction in the naming.
DPP is a Dish Pro Plus LNB or LNBF. The hybrid is a DPH LNB or LNBF.
It's technically more accurate to say "LNBF" than "LNB." The LNBF includes the antenna, low-noise amplifier, block downconverter, and feedhorn.
 
....and have been for years, which quickly becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That said however, how hard would it be to mention this to retailers on the Retailer Portal? We get emails from our rep weekly and this hasn't been mentioned ONCE.
Reminds me of my Viasat days when they would send emails that covered virtually nothing that was actually relevant to their dealers and NOT mention things that were absolutely vital, like the time they changed the keys and didn't say a word about it which caused literally thousands of tech hours to be lost the following days.
Well, all of their malfeasance, misconduct & mismanagement is going to go away within a few years as they rightfully lose cx's in droves and will be compelled to either shutter satellite altogether or to maintain an unprofitable basic rural service.
I am confused on what LNBs are called. Is the DPP version called LNBF? What is the hybrid version called?
DPH, apparently, which would only make sense. All DBS antenna (dish) electronics units are referenced as LNBFs (Low-Noise Amplifier with Block Down-Conversion & Feed - "LNABDCF" would be too wordy), which evolved from LNAs & LNBs as used on C/Ku band. So now there would be 4 different (500) Twins: The old original, the DP, the DPP and now this DPH. I do see that DiSH referenced as "LNB" on that WO. That's just an abb. for LNBF.
 
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LNB is a low noise block. LNBF is a low noise block feed. They are names for the same type of signal receiving apparatus, there is no distinction in the naming.
DPP is a Dish Pro Plus LNB or LNBF. The hybrid is a DPH LNB or LNBF.
It's technically more accurate to say "LNBF" than "LNB." The LNBF includes the antenna, low-noise amplifier, block downconverter, and feedhorn.
Got it. Thanks Jim5506
 
Got it. Thanks Jim5506
LNBF doesn't include antenna, which would be the dish. The feed (F) is simply the "horn(s)" that face the dish to collect the signal. I guess it by that could be considered to contain a "component" of the antenna- a device to collect & convey the dish's reflected signal. LNAs and LNBs need to be attached to a separate feedhorn, and LNAs further needed to be connected to a standalone BDC for rx's using block downconversion. LNBs incorporated the BDC that was sometimes added on to an LNA and were just called LNBs instead of "LNABDCs" for brevity.
 
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LNBF doesn't include antenna, which would be the dish. The feed (F) is simply the "horn(s)" that face the dish to collect the signal. I guess it by that could be considered to contain a "component" of the antenna- a device to collect & convey the dish's reflected signal. LNAs and LNBs need to be attached to a separate feedhorn.
Thanks telstar_1
 
It may well be that there aren't enough WA spot transponders available to co locate all of the EA only ones. Remember that there is a satellite being moved over to the 110 slot. That may relieve that issue. So, perhaps, Dish is doing this transformation slowly going by geography to get a head start on the inevitable.
The E15 move is just a replacement. It is conus so does not affect locals
 
As for EA, I didn't say they were retiring it right now, I said as early as next spring.
Only Echostar knows the status of their satellites. Some of the satellites are getting "old" and maybe they are initiating contingency plans to address the possible loss of a satellite in the next few years (or sooner).

So it could be next year. ----- or not
 
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Also we haven't explained what block downconversion (the 'B' in LNBF) exactly is. An LNA (either standalone or as the front section of an LNB/F) simply amplifies the satellite signal without altering its frequencies. On early C-band systems, the LNA was connected to a downconverter, usually via a short length of large-dia. coax using the large 'N' connectors. Couldn't send the signal on regular coax or very far on any coax as it's the microwave-frequency sat signal. The downconverter was typically strapped to the dish pole or to the feed assembly (LNA & feedhorn) and controlled by the rx via wire to select individual xpdrs, which the downconverter then sent in to the rx on regular coax using a much lower-frequency "intermediate" (IF) carrier, typically 70 mhz (this could be called "single downconversion").

With block downconversion, all xpdrs are downconverted simultaneously to individual IFs (a "block" of frequencies), either with a standalone BDC connected to LNA or by using an LNB (which combines LNA and BDC). On C-band, either all 12 xpdrs as V (vertical polarization) would be sent in at once, with the rx then tuning the desired 1 of the 12, or if then selecting a ch. on an H (horizontal) polarization, the rx would command the feed to switch from V to H, and then the same 12 xpdrs as H-polarized would be sent in, on the same IF carriers, to pick from. The limitation was that any 2nd receiver in the home would only be able to select from odd #'d ch's if the 1st rx was on odd, or only even #'d ch's if the 1st was on even. And of course, comparing with DBS, you couldn't view from 2 different sat positions at once. Later C-band options included using a feed with 2 LNB's, one mounted horizontally and the other vertically, to allow for independent odd-even selection (but still limited to same sat).

When DBS came out it continued this same block downconversion for Single LNBFs, adding H/V switching by the device power (on the coax) being toggled between 13 and 18v. Dual LNBFs then allowed the use of added in-line switches to do the toggling to serve multiple rx's, but you had to run 4 coaxes in from the dish (for the initial 500, 2 for 300). The initial 500 Twin had built-in switching and still used 13/18 to switch. DP (DishPro) Twin (and Single) then "stacked" both the H & V signals into 2 differentiated blocks of IFs that all went down the coax together, so you could go straight from LNBF to 2 dual-tuner rx's with no switch in-line (just those HF splitters at the rx's). The freq. stacking resulted in higher-ranging IFs (intermediate block freq's) that sometimes exposed weaknesses in coax runs. DPP (DishPro Plus) merely added an input to the DP Twin/Triple that could combine in the output from a DP Single on a separate dish with no need for a combiner/switch. DP & DPP are exactly the same to rx's save for this added input connection.

Now somebody gets to explain how the DPH works, as I have no idea...
 
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It may well be that there aren't enough WA spot transponders available to co locate all of the EA only ones. Remember that there is a satellite being moved over to the 110 slot. That may relieve that issue. So, perhaps, Dish is doing this transformation slowly going by geography to get a head start on the inevitable.
Frankly, I'm confused bout several things. LOS for East Coast customers.
The loss of subs who don't have LOS for WA, but do for EA

And moving that much traffic back to two sats
 
....and have been for years, which quickly becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. That said however, how hard would it be to mention this to retailers on the Retailer Portal? We get emails from our rep weekly and this hasn't been mentioned ONCE.
Reminds me of my Viasat days when they would send emails that covered virtually nothing that was actually relevant to their dealers and NOT mention things that were absolutely vital, like the time they changed the keys and didn't say a word about it which caused literally thousands of tech hours to be lost the following days.
Not only changed the keys, but still put the old keys on the work orders and THEN removed the Viasat Installer portal so you could no longer look up a customer to see what their Modem Key and Customer Code was
 
LNB is a low noise block. LNBF is a low noise block feed. They are names for the same type of signal receiving apparatus, there is no distinction in the naming.
DPP is a Dish Pro Plus LNB or LNBF. The hybrid is a DPH LNB or LNBF.
It's technically more accurate to say "LNBF" than "LNB." The LNBF includes the antenna, low-noise amplifier, block downconverter, and feedhorn.
In the olden days, the only name we had was LNA (Low Noise Amplifier). Then block down conversion come along as LNBA (Low Noise BLock converting Amplifier). That's mostly fallen out of favor, but I still use it out of habit. Both LNB and LNBF are the common acronyms these days.

But, no matter which acronym you use, most here will know what you mean (but perhaps with minor acronym police quibbling).
 
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How does DPH work?

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